Russian Marking/Stigma Thread

[Bunker]

I know we have a bunch of Russian marking/stigma threads but thought I'd start one that's consolidated and easy to find/track.  I personally have a hard time finding each one.  If there is one in the restricted section, please disregard.  Not sure if applicable to Russian SKSs but I've seen it on several Russian weapons.  There are three (maybe four) related Leningrad facilities that I'm aware of...this is one of them.

Artel Plant Primus, Leningrad

[running-man]

I've never seen that one an an SKS, though I guess I've never looked for it either!   Here's the Leningrad stamp that is most common to SKSs Bunker, 75th ABV, Leningrad:




The only other Leningrad associated stamp I've seen is this one, No. 7, Leningrad:

which I've never seen on anything.

I will have similar setups for all the common stamps once I get them entered, sized, and characterized.  I've found some new ones that are (as far as I know) still unknown stamps.  It would be nice if we could get someone from Chumak's team on guns.ru to look over our final lists and see if we missed something, or if we have something assigned to a facility that is wrong.  As of now I probably have 15 or 20 of them.  All these stamps will have their own dedicated pages on the forthcoming Russian sksguide pages. 

[Loose}{Cannon]

I'm really glad to see you guys taking the Russian conundrum by the balls...  Keep up the work!

[running-man]

Just fount a neat little /12\ on a Russian / Sino-Banian receiver.  I had the drawing already made up, so I think this is one Chumak has already noted.  I'll check and see if it's a known GRAU/ABV. 

[Loose}{Cannon]

Now that's interesting!

[Dannyboy53]

This gets better by the day, fascinating running-man...thanks!

[Bunker]

Not an uncommon marking but is the Tulsky marking uncommon for this rifle?

[Bunker]

Just fount a neat little /12\ on a Russian / Sino-Banian receiver.  I had the drawing already made up, so I think this is one Chumak has already noted.  I'll check and see if it's a known GRAU/ABV. 

I see they have the triangle 12 and some other triangle numbers listed in their undeciphered list but possibly new info has emerged since that listing?

[running-man]

Not an uncommon marking but is the Tulsky marking uncommon for this rifle?

I've no idea how common it is on an SKS, but I'll throw out that in my 15 years dealing with SKSs, that is the only one I've ever seen!  That is an cool stamp, very detailed strike and nice and large too. Very unlike the simple [/] or <> variations typically seen on the tops of receiver covers.

Where'd you find it?  The gun appears to be maybe a post '54 gun from some of the features I see (post '55 if the 'blank' receiver cover is to be believed). I'll compare the prefix to the spreadsheet and see what might turn up.

Awesome find, thanks for posting it!! 

PS: After going through my entire lists, this is the first occurrence I have on record of prefix ФП.  No listings for it in Kurgan's registry either... 

[Bunker]

I had it saved in my archives and I know it was on one of the Russian forums because of my labeling system.  I'll see if I can locate the link for you.  First Tulsky marking I seen on an SKS too.  From my understanding that is a Tulsky "commercial" marking but not 100% certain on that?

Edit: Looking at Frank Iannamico's book, he labels the trade mark as modern stylized logo of the Tula Ordnance Plant and I've seen several references of it being commercial, so still digging.  Will dig through Wetlands to see if there is anything there.  Here are a few pages from a TOZ-49 translated manual that list that stigma.  Circa. 1969-71 the TOZ-49 was developed.  We know it was used later but trying to narrow down when that marking was first used.  I seen a trade mark patent that lists it as 1 Jan 1970 but it's not the greatest reference, so I don't have much confidence in that for now.




Modern "Civilian" TOZ stigma:

[Loose}{Cannon]

 

[running-man]

Pretty neat reference Bunker.  I'd always heard that the Tulsky mark was a more recent one that superseded the various flavors of Tula stars as well.  I've only ever seen it on more modern stuff, indeed they still use one pretty much exactly as shown on that receiver cover stamp as the logo on their webpage http://tulatoz.ru/en/:


Interesting to note that in 2001 (according to the pro-disarmament small gun survey project out of Switzerland), these were the sales of the various Russian Plants:

Company	Total sales (millions of 2004 USD)	# Employees
JSC Izhmash	199.5	27300
VA Degtyarev Plant (ZID)	84.3	15000
JSC Izhevsky Mekhanischesky Zavod (IMZ)	57.7	15200
JSC Tulsky Oruzheiny Zavod	13.4	7000
JSC Kovrov Mechanical Plant (KMP)	22.2	3000
Vyatskiye Polyany Machine Building Plant Molot	21.2	7430

I was surprised that Tulsky was so far down the list in both $ sales and # of employees!

[running-man]

Not sure if applicable to Russian SKSs but I've seen it on several Russian weapons.  There are three (maybe four) related Leningrad facilities that I'm aware of...this is one of them.

Artel Plant Primus, Leningrad

Just found this one going through my files.  What does everyone think of the stamp at the center of the barrel lug here.  Same information (Л within a larger П) in perhaps a slightly different stamp?  Maybe a Л within a box?

[Loose}{Cannon]

Looks like П to me....  No doubt about it. 

[running-man]

Different gun, same area.  Hard to say if it's a Л within a larger П on this one though.
If it is a Artel Plant Primus, Leningrad stamp, they appear to consistently reside on the left barrel lug on an SKS.

[Loose}{Cannon]

These are def not the 'Л'....   

[Bunker]

Completely different markings.  The one on the left is the Artel Plant stigma and the one on the right is a repair stigma.  There is also different variations (e.g., no box)

[Bunker]

Is the unpacked diamond stigma common for Russian refurb'd SKSs?

[running-man]

Is the unpacked diamond stigma common for Russian refurb'd SKSs?

Yes, it's actually quite a common stigma, probably less common than 1st GRAU @ Balakleya, but more than many others.

I have it currently as "D0" which is the first unknown diamond stamp in the list.



I've only ever seen it on the receiver cover, whereas others appears on the receiver, receiver cover, stock, etc.

Speaking of diamond stamps, I have quite a few 'unknown' ones (that may indeed be be known by now!):

D2:



D3 (not seen by me on an SKS yet):


D5 (not seen by me on an SKS yet):


D6 (not seen by me on an SKS yet):


D7:

[running-man]

Completely different markings.  The one on the left is the Artel Plant stigma and the one on the right is a repair stigma.  There is also different variations (e.g., no box)

Very neat, yup certainly a different marking there.  In that case, I've never seen an Artel stigma on an SKS (but I'll be looking for it going forward!)!