Chinese sight leafs, somewhat explained perhaps?

[Justin Hell]

9m and 10m cyrillic U
23m III  ( LC)
/206\ D
/906\ D
DB....well, you tell me...its a 3 though.  Despite the photo glare, the bluing, patina and general grime makes it seem original and consistent with the rest of the sloppily built thing that it is.

[Worm]

Thanks Justin  That's the DB I was talking about that had the 3! lol I knew I had seen it here just couldn't remember from who or where.

Two questions, does your 206 & 906 have any heavy or obvious battle wear? And are either of them exported from Norinco?

[Justin Hell]

Thanks Justin  That's the DB I was talking about that had the 3! lol I knew I had seen it here just couldn't remember from who or where.

Two questions, does your 206 & 906 have any heavy or obvious battle wear? And are either of them exported from Norinco?

The /206\ only had moderate wear, but I bought it used in an ATI folder...so someone had it and could have loved it a lil bit.  The /906\ was new....they are both Norinco exports.

[Worm]

Thanks Justin. Who knows, I may be way off base here 

[Justin Hell]

It is certainly a facet worth discussion.  Perhaps  the only way to confirm leaf lineage is if it is serialed to the gun.  Of the ones I listed, they are all serialed to the gun, with the possible exception of the non legible number on the 9m.  I cannot fathom someone going to the trouble of reserialing a replacement leaf...who knows though.

I cleaned the heck out of the DB and double checked in bright light and GUESS WHAT?! 

The DB leaf IS serialed to the gun...so that goofy leaf is original! It has the nicest penmanship I have ever seen on an SKS.  It is so nice I had do look very closely to see that it isn't actually stamped on there. 

[running-man]

Here's some info from my observed photos:

П:
Soviet-Sino
Ghost
/26\ six-digit, 2-3, mil
/26\ letter prefix
/26\ 6 mil - '1.5' mil
[0221] 3.0 mil
/636\ 1.4 mil (2 different examples), 1.7 mil

III:
/26\ 23 mil, 24 mil

3:
<0203> 24 mil
DP 2.5 mil, 24 mil
(974) 23 mil
(9696) 1.3 mil
[0129] 240k
[0221] 25 mil
/016\ 1.7 mil (Public Security Gun), 18 mil, 24 mil, 27 mil, 29 mil
/106\ 23 mil
/0130\ 2.2 mil
/156\ 1.5 mil
/0223a\ 21 mil, 22 mil, 25 mil
/316\ 2.3 mil
/0408\ 24 mil, 25 mil
/636\ 20 mil, 21 mil, 22 mil
/906\ 1.6 mil

D:
<0203> 220 mil (may be a replacement)
M21 'NO'
M21 No
[0134] 23 mil
[0138] '70' (stamped receivers)
[0141] '73'
[0224] 21 mil
/36\ 1.8 mil
/216\ 1.5 mil, 18 mil
/306\ 1.5 mil
/526\ 1.6 mil
/906\ 1.7 mil (may be a replacement)


It's way more consistent arsenal to arsenal than I would have thought.....

[Loose}{Cannon]

You ARE going to have outfliers... I have personally built/swapped several rear sights on multiple guns, and Im sure the Chinese were capable of installing any of the variations on any rifle especially in later years.  Everything from rebuilt /26\ guns sporting a non П to other arsenals that could have received left over parts from Jianshe.

[Loose}{Cannon]

In addition, Justins leaf could have been taken off and the sliders from an AK installed at and point.     The slider is the only component that dont jive.

[running-man]

You ARE going to have outfliers... I have personally built/swapped several rear sights on multiple guns, and Im sure the Chinese were capable of installing any of the variations on any rifle especially in later years.  Everything from rebuilt /26\ guns sporting a non П to other arsenals that could have received left over parts from Jianshe.

Right, there's certainly no smoking gun here.  I was honestly expecting to see arsenals strewn about the entire spectrum, but that's really not necessarily the case.  It could be my small sample size though.
/636\, [0221], and <0203> are about the only crossovers I've been able to find and I think the [0221] is suspect.

The IIIs are pretty rock solid.  They go hand in hand with the special takedown levers, takedown reliefs in the stocks, and phenolic handguards.  Those 23 and 24 mils from 1978/1979 are special...especially when compared to others from the same time period which generally sport a "3" except for a couple 21 & 23 mil outliers.

The П's seem pretty solid too.  The /636\'s are consistent up to the 1.7 mil examples I have..then they consistently jump to 3's at 20 mil.

The D's are the ones that are interesting....a few outliers, but they generally exist in the 1970-1973 timeframe.  VN war aid materials?

[Worm]

Wow, lot to soak in here.

RM, I was thinking the same as for the D's maybe being ad to Nam.. But then why have D's for Security force guns? Unless they were "made" security force guns later on?

Jeesh I just don't know anymore. What have I started. 

[Loose}{Cannon]

The /636\ having the n for only two years after jianshe stopped production is a good indicator of using up leftovers.   

[Justin Hell]

Look closer at the DB leaf pic of mine. 

There is a lot more off base than just the slider buttons.  First off, the notch is a V rather than the standard slit on a regular leaf.  Secondly...look at the graduation notches on the sides, there is only one notch per position...so only one side locks in, which causes quite a bit of wiggle.  They also are not uniform in depth...nor are the indicator notches in the top of the leaf, the numbers are haphazardly stamped.  This thing was hand made from a blank.

The gas block and particularly the battle position is a mess...possibly to do with the wiggly nature of the way the leaf is notched.   I will try to post some pics tomorrow of the serial on the underside...I am thinking smearing some talc into it might make it visible...as well as better close ups of its odd nature.

I suspect the V notch would be necessary as you attempt to walk up the sight from side to side...the angle with a slit might make it impossible to see through after even one shot once it goes crooked from recoil. The wide view of the V notch could 'make up' for this design flaw.

It may be a POS....but she sure is unique.  I literally don't trust the irons farther than I can throw the rifle.  Luckily, a crappy RC mount of mine fits it snug as a bug...so it probably will be scoped for shooting....if I can bring up the courage to shoot it. 

[Worm]

You're right, that thing is unique. Interesting. Can't think of why it would be different unless it was just a different process for that particular factory at the time.. dunno

[Justin Hell]

I wonder if it was a prototype for a new factory testing out their casting process...as it does appear to be primarily cast on a number of the parts, the machining of the casting is quite rough.  One might expect somewhat of a unique serial if it were something new...I suspect this was from a run of similarly made guns though.

I also have been thinking...could these be from an armorer's school?  You do have to teach folk how to build these things, maybe this was made on Monday morning after Chinese New Year by a student?    A DP I recently saw was of similar quality...but IIRC the leaf was a normal 3 type.

It seems odd that it would be hand made, when the normal leaves are obviously pretty uniform, aside from the symbol used on them. Perhaps there was a shortage of leaves, and they had to maintain a quota or face a firing squad. Maybe these were so shoddily made so that they might have a chance if their own rifles were used on them by a firing squad for not keeping up with their quota?   

Perhaps it was a pet project of an armorer with OCD who just had to figure out how to make this thing shoot straight...and this was what he came up with? 

We likely will never know, but I will be keeping my eyes peeled for more of these.  I am dying to know if this is only a one off, or if there was a short run done like this.

[Worm]

More than likely just a short run, just like the bulged stock Ferrells on a short run of 9 Mills and plenty other examples.

But, who the hell knows.

[Loose}{Cannon]

I hadn't noticed the number of notches....   its just weird.  No tellin.

[running-man]

I hadn't noticed the number of notches....   its just weird.  No tellin.

The thing is, they are offset from each other on the two sides, not lining up like the notches on a std leaf do. Can the slider actually engage a single notch on either side?  I know there are spring loaded buttons on both sides of the slider, but I admit I've never actually pulled one totally apart to see what make them tick...

[Justin Hell]

I hadn't noticed the number of notches....   its just weird.  No tellin.

The thing is, they are offset from each other on the two sides, not lining up like the notches on a std leaf do. Can the slider actually engage a single notch on either side?  I know there are spring loaded buttons on both sides of the slider, but I admit I've never actually pulled one totally apart to see what make them tick...

I was curious about how the heck those buttons and springs work when I was searching for a proper replacement for this leaf....until I noticed it was numbered to the gun.  Many available were leaf, spring, button, button spring and slider...when you added it all up it was quite spendy!  Plus you get the added joy of trying to assemble it.  After replacing a leaf spring on my /206\ I have shied away from considering any sight that messes with the RSB...I can only imagine the ordeal involved in getting the tiny springs into the buttons.

At least I don't have to replace it anymore.

It does engage in the slots on either side...whichever side doesn't engage moves considerably it is the most hairbrained thing I have seen on a gun.  Why would you reinvent the wheel when the sight leaf is about the only thing (aside from that pesky marking) that is consistent for virtually all SKS's?   Sure the Yugo's get to be all flamboyant with the shiny metal and night sights...but essentially, it is the same design.

The fact that it has the 3 on there just adds to the frustration of what the heck those markings mean anyway...considering this odd attempt at fabrication includes that must mean something....right?

[Loose}{Cannon]

They come apart and go back together very easily....  give it a try sometime, the worst part is getting the leaf off. Practice makes perfect.

[Justin Hell]

They come apart and go back together very easily....  give it a try sometime, the worst part is getting the leaf off. Practice makes perfect.

Yeah...getting the leaf off was my biggest woe, getting it back on with the spring installed (properly) was nearly as difficult.  I didn't have to mess with the buttons.  On the DB I nearly ordered replacement buttons and springs as I thought one side was broken...that is, until I noticed only one side could lock in.

I don't do ranges...we shoot out in the woods. I rarely get to shoot beyond what most would use the 'battle' position for...so I rarely even mess with the rear sight.  There is usually a mountain in the way of shooting any farther.  For many more years than I care to say...I had a hair tie holding the leaf down so it wouldn't bounce up after every shot on my first SKS.  Fortunately for my poor guns, I have edjumacated myself a tad better.