GB listings for December, 2016 - Russian

[running-man]

Last post of the season for the Russians.

Number sold: 38
Lowest Sale Price: $298.00
Avg. Sale Price: $570.03
Highest Sale Price: $1130.00
Tula Avg. Price: $596.57
Izhevsk Avg. Price: $555.00
As-Issued Avg. Price: $820.00

Please let me know any feedback (good or bad) to these.

If you have an objection or observation to add to anything I've listed, by all means call it out.  Let's look at it long and hard (I only look at each listing for a minute or two at most) and maybe everyone can learn a thing or two! 

-RM

Item Link   Description   # Bids   Final Price   Year   Arsenal   Arsenal Condition   Current Condition   S/N   RM's Notes

602279180   Russian SKS 1954R Tula 7.62X39 #s match NoReserve   22   $530.00    1954   Tula   As-Issued   Fair   KA2220   The good news: Original 63 year old stock!  The bad news: Original 63 year old stock!

603574357   Russian SKS Numbers Matching 7.62x39 $.01 Start NR   39   $800.00    1956   Tula   As-Issued   Good   TM388_Д   Slight possibility that the stock has been refinished or is not the original from this gun, but man it sure is a nice looker!

602220379   Russian SKS 7.62x39 Semi Auto Rifle w/Bayo $1START REALLY NICE NUMBERS MATCHING RIFLE MUST SEE GUN   46   $1,130.00    1956   Tula   As-Issued   Good   TB839_Д   Very nice looking firearm here!

606815535   Russian SKS 7.62x39 Tula 1951 Russia 7.62 x 39   22   $415.00    1951   Tula   Bubba   Fair   KГ1621   Almost a nice one but not quite.

607729022   RUSSIAN SKS (ALL MATCHING NUMBERS)   19   $475.00    1952   Tula   Bubba   Fair   Uncertain   Classic limp bayo here.  Angled ear collar on a straight ear lightening cut lug.

604773486   Russian SKS OD Green Stock w Remov. Mag & Bipod   1   $599.00    1952   Tula   Bubba   Fair   CM2943   Per the S/N and feature set, this one is a '52.

601216867   Russian SKS Tula Arsenal 7.62x39 nice!! Extras   38   $680.00    1953   Tula   Bubba   Good   ЛH3777   Left-handed inverted takedown lever!

602930630   russian sks   16   $504.00    1954   Tula   Bubba   Good   ГT5141   Receiver cover swap just killed any extra value this thing will ever have.

605716034   Tula Russian SKS 1954R 7.62x39mm VG+ $99 NR   25   $600.00    1954   Tula   Bubba   Very Good   KA6900   Man, that's a horrible shame about the replacement Izhevsk receiver cover.

605333230   Russian SKS 7.62 x 39 Sporter Stock Penny Auction!   11   $301.00    Uncertain   Uncertain   Bubba   Fair   OC4156   Meh :/

604775564   Century Arms International SKS (Russian)   1   $450.00    Uncertain   Uncertain   Bubba   Uncertain   Uncertain   I guess it's Russian.

603866453   Russian SKS Tula 1950 ex-DDR Liski   8   $421.00    1950   Tula   Heavy Refurbished   Fair   TЛ417   Just not a pretty gun.  Looks to have been badly pitted at one time...

605381192   Russian SKS rifle 7.62x39 FREE SHIP 1951 Tula   11   $501.00    1951   Tula   Heavy Refurbished   Fair   TЮ3311   Interesting late NHM import.  Don't see too many of these.  Not in the best of condition though.

602633529   Russian SKS 45 Semi Auto Carbine 7.62x39mm Caliber   1   $549.00    1951   Tula   Heavy Refurbished   Good   Uncertain   Meh :/

603637117   Russian SKS 7.62x39 7.62 Rifle Enfield Jungle 303 Carbine No 5 MK1 British   21   $555.00    1951   Tula   Heavy Refurbished   Good   TC3569   Took out $300 to reflect the price of the Enfield.  Not idea if that's accurate at all, but I can see this SKS going for 5 1/2 Benjamins.

605751854   Russian SKS 1952r 7.62x39 Rifle 1952 W Bayonet   4   $600.00    1952   Tula   Heavy Refurbished   Good   ГЛ2988   Not loving this one...

605346256   Russian SKS Rifle 7.62x39 Layaway   2   $504.00    1953   Tula   Heavy Refurbished   Good   OЛ5289   Those are some craptacular photos man!  Could have cost yourself $100 but not taking some more time to get better lighting or at least post processing them to lighten them up a little bit!

602286186   Russian Tula SKS 1953r Matching 7.62x39 Penny Auc   31   $610.00    1953   Tula   Heavy Refurbished   Good   ФЛ739   Nice enough gun, I don't care for the laminate stock with hardwood handguard though.

605322001   Russian SKS Izhevsk Russia C+R 7.62x39 not ak47 ak   12   $480.00    1954   Izhevsk   Heavy Refurbished   Good   PK362   Nice enough gun, not much respect though.

604140295   Russian SKS Tula 7.62x39 1950's Mostly Matching   26   $480.00    1954   Izhevsk   Heavy Refurbished   Fair   ГA637   What the hell does 'mostly matching' mean anyhow?!  Also, whoever told this guy this was a Tula needs slapped around a bit.  I saw the receiver font on the "A" and right away knew it was an Izhevsk.  I'm finding more and more that they are ridiculously easy to ID even with a missing receiver cover!

604393172   Russian SKS Izhevsk   7   $575.00    1954   Izhevsk   Heavy Refurbished   Fair   AП606   "These are the cream of the crop." Well cream of wheat is more like it.  Horrible Horsetrashy listing.

608302912   * Russian SKS 7.62x39 semi rifle * Tula Russia   23   $476.98    1956   Tula   Heavy Refurbished   Good   KB5420_Д   If you put enough rounds in a banana mag, will it make a full circle around the gun?

604665490   Russian SKS Russian SKS - 45 sold by KBI 7.62 x 39   15   $583.00    1957   Tula   Heavy Refurbished   Good   AO5144_И   Not a bad deal with all the accessories and extra bubba hardware.

604622005   Russian Model SKS Rifle 7.62X39 Russia 1950R 1950   46   $745.00    1950   Tula   Light Refurbished   Good   CH2272   Heck a pretty '50 here!

604853314   Tula SKS 1952 R All matching serial numbers!   2   $599.99    1952   Tula   Light Refurbished   Good   Uncertain   Terrible auction.  Not quite horsetrash, but terrible nonetheless.

601695647   Russian SKS..NIB with accessories!   5   $550.00    1953   Tula   Light Refurbished   Very Good   ДP662   Man that's a nice one.  Refurb or not, this one was a nice buy!

604404766   Russian SKS Tula 1953r   35   $560.00    1953   Tula   Light Refurbished   Good   MT3785   Decent enough gun.  I dig the /TK\ + "Tula" star on the RSL, don't see both together like this all that often.

607478104   1953 Tula SKS New Unfired in Cosmoline   1   $799.99    1953   Tula   Light Refurbished   Good   OA4817   If you look closely, you can tell this one isn't really a '53.  Likely a '51 with that prefix.

602680857   Tula SKS 762x39 Matching w/Bayonet NICE   15   $450.00    1954   Tula   Light Refurbished   Good   ИM2064   Second time this one's gone through.  Sold back in July for $650.  $200 loss, ouch.

602238420   Russian TULA SKS / Matching / NO RESERVE!   9   $520.00    1954   Tula   Light Refurbished   Good   ГE8379   Not a huge fan of guns like this one.

604574904   SKS Russian Tula 1954 **ALL MATCHING NUMBERS**   8   $530.00    1954   Tula   Light Refurbished   Good   AH2630   Decent enough gun here.

603612844   Russian Mfg. SKS rifle 7.62x39mm semi auto   22   $565.00    1954   Tula   Light Refurbished   Good   BB5798   Very nice looking firearm here!

605736314   1954 Russian SKS Tulla, must see, 7.62x39   1   $574.99    1954   Tula   Light Refurbished   Good   AO1638   Nice little refurb here.

599525705   MINT 1954 RUSSIAN SKS ALL MATCHING #'S 7.62X39 C&R COLLECTOR GRADE TULA USSR LIKE AK 47 AK47   29   $685.00    1954   Izhevsk   Light Refurbished   Good   B798_У   Might be a bit on the pricey side when all the dust settles in 2016.  It is a nice gun though, w/o the stock finish wear it would have rated VG.

607355909   Unfired in box Russian SKS w/acces. 1954 BIN get FREE ship 7.62x39 sks-45 Norinco ak47   1   $799.00    1954   Tula   Light Refurbished   Good   Uncertain   Horsetrash, Horsetrash, Horsetrash.

605214109   Russian SKS KBI Import, Rebuilt, Unfired, $20 UPS   6   $670.00    1958   Tula   Light Refurbished   Good   CM4895_K   This one went through GB before...

606331361   USSR Russian SKS carbine 7.62x39   23   $298.00    Uncertain   Uncertain   Light Refurbished   Fair   ЛП1940   Some pretty crappy photos for this one.  Downright cheap for 23 bids, what were they bidding up $1 each time?!

605019762   SKS RUSSIAN,7.62X39 (TULA),LAMINATED STOCK,EXTRAS.   4   $495.00    Uncertain   Uncertain   Uncertain   Uncertain   Uncertain   H-O-R-S-E-T-R-A-S-H!!!

[korea1950]

I bought the Russian Letter gun 1956 year # t388.  You looked at the unique stock finish and had questioned (slightly) whether the stock was a replacement or refinished.  Well, this stock is original and not replaced or refinished. The rifle has the serial number (in the correct Russian type number stampings) on the left of the stock plus on the right side of the stock the armory proof stamp. If you take a look at the left forward screw area you will see deep triangles armory proof marks.  On the underside of the rifle which you can not see there are many (7+) other armory marks all "cut" into the shellac.   All of the armory marks are cut into the shellac. If you were to rework this stock and refinish it with shellac, the armory stamps would be sanded over, not very visable and covered over, and not have sharpe edges into the shellac.   I know, I  professionally with wood.  he rifle also has matching serial numbers on the gas tube, the gas piston and the rear sight in addition to all of the other numbers (inside bolt, the bolt carrier, the dust cover, the receiver, the trigger guard, the bottom of the magazine, the stock etc.).   It is the real deal and I believe it has never been fired.

[running-man]

Very nice!  .

There are often times where I caveat my opinions because 1) I'm simply not the ultimate authority on Russian SKS45s, I keep learning new things about them every day and 2) gunbroker photos are often notoriously hard to judge the condition of original finishes, patina, etc.  The stock looked extra shiny, this could be a result of a really nice finish and odd lighting, a layer of protective grease still covering it, or a refinish.

As for the 'unfiredness', that is certainly impossible to tell via GB photos. It is likely difficult to tell even with a close-up inspection, a clean gun does not automatically equal unfired.  Surely the gun was tested with at least one proof round when it came off the line to verify fit and function. I tend to stay away from the terms 'unfired', 'unissued', and 'non/unrefurbished'.  Those are things that we as collectors, 60 years after these firearms were made simply cannot know with any degree of certainty without being privy to the entire life of the firearm from the original manufacture, initial testing, issuance, storage while in service, refurbishment (if any), additional service (if any), additional refurbishment (if any), decommissioning, long term storage, export, import and finally use in the States since the import.

Again, nice buy, if you want to post up a photo spread of it in all its glory, many here would be very appreciative! 

[armedhippie]

603637117   Russian SKS 7.62x39 7.62 Rifle Enfield Jungle 303 Carbine No 5 MK1 British   21   $555.00    1951   Tula   Heavy Refurbished   Good   TC3569   Took out $300 to reflect the price of the Enfield.  Not idea if that's accurate at all, but I can see this SKS going for 5 1/2 Benjamins.

I'm definitely no expert on enfields but With nice No 4 Enfields going anywhere from $280-$450 ( like most milsurps these days trending toward the higher end) I'd put that No 5 at the $400+ range easy. If its not a chop job, they can bring some bucks.

This pair was a good deal all around on both for sure. 

[newchi]

603866453   Russian SKS Tula 1950 ex-DDR Liski   8   $421.00    1950   Tula   Heavy Refurbished   Fair   TЛ417   Just not a pretty gun.  Looks to have been badly pitted at one time...

Pardon me for asking but whats ex-DDR Liski supposed to mean in the way of the SKS?
I just saw a Russian gun.  Are there markings or something?

[Greasemonkey]

603637117   Russian SKS 7.62x39 7.62 Rifle Enfield Jungle 303 Carbine No 5 MK1 British   21   $555.00    1951   Tula   Heavy Refurbished   Good   TC3569   Took out $300 to reflect the price of the Enfield.  Not idea if that's accurate at all, but I can see this SKS going for 5 1/2 Benjamins.

I'm definitely no expert on enfields but With nice No 4 Enfields going anywhere from $280-$450 ( like most milsurps these days trending toward the higher end) I'd put that No 5 at the $400+ range easy. If its not a chop job, they can bring some bucks.

This pair was a good deal all around on both for sure. 

An actual true blue No5, not those Gibbs or Santa Fe chop jobs your looking at 5-550 for a decent plain jane no frills shooter/shoulder buster

something else I bought I aint posted

[running-man]

Ex-DDR is a notion that was ginned up on gunboards many years ago. Someone saw a /1\ mark on a Mosin Nagant, then saw a slightly similar /1\ marking on a pre-WWII commercial export from Germany and concluded that Russian guns with /1\ markings were obviously used in East Germany as part of a lend lease program. Zero data to back even the smallest assertation up, but then it got posted and reposted and reposted across umpteen different gun sites and became gospel. The /1\ mark meant ex-DDR, period, end of story, no discussion allowed.

For SKSs, things even went a step farther. The /1\ stamping on the receiver is often very poorly struck or otherwise unreadable. There are, however, other very commonly seen features such as horizontal serial numbers on the left side of the handguard and horizonal S/Ns on the stocks. Any one of those features automatically indicated ex-DDR in many people's eyes regardless of the /1\ stampings and that was that, end of story, no discussion allowed.

About two years ago, a Russian researcher by the name of Ruslan Chumak published a paper on refurb stamp identification in the former USSR and indicated that the /1\ stamp was from the 1871st ABV based in Liski. Since then, Ruslan has indicated that he made a mistake and /1\ actually indicates the 41st Central ABV located in Irkutsk.

So, we basically had two competing camps with a fair amount of $$ on the line tied up in ex-DDR premiums for certain firearms.  Back in 2013, I nearly pulled the trigger on a gunbroker deal for a very nice /1\ SKS that had a price of $800.  Seeing what light refurb prices are now, I'm quite glad the deal never went through.

I tend to believe Ruslan's research over the pro ex-DDR guys as he is exceptionally thorough and careful. Everyone is free to make up their own minds, but all the data tends to point towards Irkutsk, not East Germany.

[Phosphorus32]

+1 on RM's request

Would love to see a good pictorial on that letter gun Korea1950   

[newchi]

Ex-DDR is a notion that was ginned up on gunboards many years ago.

I see, kinda like the numbers 1, 2 or 3 on the sight mean how accurate it is?
I mean really, if you got issued a 3 in the morning by lunchtime it would have accidentally fallen under a passing T72.
Whoops, i need a new rifle.

[pcke2000]

I wonder if anyone here is collecting refurb Russians just for studies on different refurb marks.

[cztulsa]

Ex-DDR is a notion that was ginned up on gunboards many years ago.

I see, kinda like the numbers 1, 2 or 3 on the sight mean how accurate it is?
I mean really, if you got issued a 3 in the morning by lunchtime it would have accidentally fallen under a passing T72.
Whoops, i need a new rifle.

Probably right.  I've owned 7 Russian SKSs over the last few years, and every one had a "1" stamped on the front sight.  I think that was just something someone dreamed up to try and glean a few extra bucks on gunbroker, armslist, etc.

[korea1950]

RunningMan.

Thanks for the reply to my posting on the SKS TM388 that I bought.  I guess the stock looks shinny due to the lighting in the picture when it was taken.  The stock has a good, hard red shellac coating (like other Russian rifles wood from this period) and it really does reflect light when it is pointed at the rifle.  All the armory proof marks are very clear and as I said they are press/cut into the shellac and not covered by another non-original recoating.  The red shellac coating is really unique and the gun is quite a "looker" which is one of the reasons that I bought it besides having all of the aspects of a "letter rifle"originality (correct markings, matching serial numbers throughout the entire rifle, etc.).  Yes, I am sure that it has been fired, but I don't believe too much as the bolt carrier and internal moving parts show minimal friction wear.   When I take a picture I will post it for another reference mark for us collectors.....    Best regards     

[Boris Badinov]

Quoth RM 599525705   MINT 1954 RUSSIAN SKS ALL MATCHING #'S 7.62X39 C&R COLLECTOR GRADE TULA USSR LIKE AK 47 AK47   29   $685.00    1954   Izhevsk   Light Refurbished   Good   B798_У   Might be a bit on the pricey side when all the dust settles in 2016.  It is a nice gun though, w/o the stock finish wear it would have rated VG.

You do a great job in with all of these, RM.

Thanks for all the effort!

I agree. I overpaid, but not by too much I hope. I probably entered this auction too early and held the top bid for too long at $550.00 until some joker bid me up in the final hour. After that it was too hard to give up. Glad I ended up with it. More glad that it didn't get to my max bid (classified).

Out to the range with it this week I hope as my range closes for the month of February.

[running-man]

RunningMan.

Thanks for the reply to my posting on the SKS TM388 that I bought.  I guess the stock looks shinny due to the lighting in the picture when it was taken.  The stock has a good, hard red shellac coating (like other Russian rifles wood from this period) and it really does reflect light when it is pointed at the rifle.  All the armory proof marks are very clear and as I said they are press/cut into the shellac and not covered by another non-original recoating.  The red shellac coating is really unique and the gun is quite a "looker" which is one of the reasons that I bought it besides having all of the aspects of a "letter rifle"originality (correct markings, matching serial numbers throughout the entire rifle, etc.).  Yes, I am sure that it has been fired, but I don't believe too much as the bolt carrier and internal moving parts show minimal friction wear.   When I take a picture I will post it for another reference mark for us collectors.....    Best regards   

No worries at all! It sounds like you're quite taken with it and it's certainly a nice one. I'm very partial towards the letter suffix guns with original ruby red laminate stocks myself.  Whether laminate or hardwood, originally stocked letter guns just seem to be nice in general. 

[running-man]

I wonder if anyone here is collecting refurb Russians just for studies on different refurb marks.

Just the photos of other peoples guns for me Cpt. Ke, just the photos. My wife already thinks I have too many in my collection as it is. 

[pcke2000]

I wonder if anyone here is collecting refurb Russians just for studies on different refurb marks.

Just the photos of other peoples guns for me Cpt. Ke, just the photos. My wife already thinks I have too many in my collection as it is. 

RM, I too wish I have more money, time, and space for a big collection. I am 'fascinated' by refurb marks, not only the marks on Russian SKS's, but also those on other Russian/Soviet military equipment, and the history behind them. For example, on some refurb military binoculars you can find exactly same type of marks stamped on SKS. It seems like Russians love refurbishing old stuff. I was very surprised to see that in 2003 Russian army still used refurb B6x30 binoculars originally manufactured in 1941.

[running-man]

Yeah. I've kept up with some of the mega threads on guns.ru. The refurb stamps are quite fascinating when you really think about it. It was definitely an interesting system of traceability long before the advent of conputers, databases, and barcodes.