Here is another newbie SKS gunsmithing question. I am now complete with my trigger job. I am pretty happy with the results. I installed the Murray spring set and have a slightly positive sear engagement. The takeup is about 3/8 of an inch and the release is smooth and crisp. I even installed the murray spring driver firing pin. So what's the beef?
Well I have one very small annoying issue. When the gun is assembled and the trigger pulled back, there is this ever so slight tick when the trigger bar starts to engage with the sear. After the tick, the sear is engaged and the gun fires smoothly as expected. I think the problem is with the disconnector not going done quite enough. The little tick seems to be the trigger bar just barely catching on whatever it catches on (sear rails maybe) and then slipping down onto the sear. I know the disconnector only needs to go down an additional couple of thousands of an inch because if I put downward pressure on the top of the bolt the tick goes away. And if I put lateral pressure on the trigger towards the right side of the gun, the tick goes away. But with even trigger pressure or slight lateral pressure to the left, the tick is there every time.
So my conclusion is that with all of the slop in the gun, the disconnector is just not quite getting pushed down enough for the trigger bar to completely clear whatever it hits on.
My first question is, does the trigger bar indeed hit the sear rails if the disconnector does not lower enough or what does it hit? I can't see for sure? Is it possible that the end of the trigger bar has flared out just a bit and the tick is the top of the bar catching on the stop? Maybe it just needs to be honed down a little bit to square off the face. Sorry, I just can see what is going on for sure because I can't take the trigger group completely apart. I tried tapping out the pin to remove the trigger bar and the pin moves moves but just won't come out. I suspect it needs to be drilled to get it out, which I would just as soon not do. This is not a show stopper, the gun works fine. It is just a minor imperfection that is driving me a little nuts. Seems silly to me to do all of this work and then fall just short of perfection.
Any explanation of how this part of the trigger group functions and what might be a cure will be appreciated.
Regards,
Do me a fovor... Take out the secondary disconnect and see if it still happens. This is the part you squeeze together and pull out to remove. Its under the disconnector and over the trigger bar.
Do NOT drill anything on the trigger... The pins will all come out if you support it and use the right dimater punch.
Quote from: Loose}{Cannon on August 08, 2015, 06:20:34 PM
... Take out the secondary disconnect and see if it still happens...
Same issue, no change. With the secondary out of there, I can see much better what is happening. If I push the disconnector down to just the right spot, I see the trigger bar move forward, just nick the sear rail, and then with a little more pressure slips down off the rail and engages the sear. It feels exactly like it does when it is in the gun. If I push the disconnector down just a smidgeon past that spot, it moves forward and smoothly engages the sear. It is definitely the disconnector not going down far enough.
The tip of the disconnector that engages with the bolt is pretty shiney. I don't know if that is normal wear and tear or if the prior owner did some filing on it. It may just be at that point where it is just a couple thousands too short to get proper disconnect. I may need to get a new disconnector.
Nah... Two options. :)
Just bend the trigger bar downward a TINY bit....
If that dont work, you can lay the disconnector bar side ways on a flat metal surface and tap the end of the bar with a hammer to swag it out a bit. This will add a few thou to the length and in turn push down further which will push the trigger bar down further. Just a few thousands!!
I know exactly what that is, because my sporter does it too.
Try to picture this... The sear block has two galleys machined down the side, which slide on the matching rails sticking out on the inside of the trigger housing. Well those rails end at some point. Under normal conditions, the sear sticks out a tad past the end of the rails. So when you pull the trigger, the trigger bar moves forward, hits the sear, and pushes it forward.
Now if you do a trigger job, sometimes during the part where you shave the sear down to get rid of creep, you shave off too much. Then what happens, is the rails stick out a tad past the sear. So now....when the trigger bar comes forward, it hits the rails first, then slips off them and engages the sear. I bet anything that's what you've got going on from what you described.
True
I never ever never take material off the sear face making contact with the trigger bar. That will increase the distance and length of trigger pull. The only way to reduce length of pull is to take back the two little angles on the sides of the sear that act as a rearward travel stop. This is where if you file them back to far and in-turn make the sear seat closer to the trigger bar, you can have an unsafe unit where the sear is engaged before the trigger stops on the safety.
If you took off material from the sear face that makes contact with the trigger bar... You did it wrong.
Quote from: Loose}{Cannon on August 08, 2015, 08:38:49 PM
True
I never ever never take material off the sear face making contact with the trigger bar. That will increase the distance and length of trigger pull. The only way to reduce length of pull is to take back the two little angles on the sides of the sear that act as a rearward travel stop. This is where if you file them back to far and in-turn make the sear seat closer to the trigger bar, you can have an unsafe unit where the sear is engaged before the trigger stops on the safety.
If you took off material from the sear face that makes contact with the trigger bar... You did it wrong.
Yeah, I only take it off the very top, just where the trigger drops off the sear. But I've seen people shave the full surface.
You mean where the 'hanmer' drops off the sear?
The top side where the hammer sits is where you make all your adjustments... Not the rear face where the trigger bar contacts. 'Sometimes' (rare) I will reduce creep by slightly reducing the side angles 'sear travel stops'.
Other then that, polishing the hammer/sear contact points, the sear/rail contact points, and hob-e-lube pure lithium grease is all thats needed.
Quote from: Loose}{Cannon on August 08, 2015, 09:01:08 PM
You mean where the 'hanmer' drops off the sear?
The top side where the hammer sits is where you make all your adjustments... Not the rear face where the trigger bar contacts. 'Sometimes' (rare) I will reduce creep by slightly reducing the side angles 'sear travel stops'.
Other then that, polishing the hammer/sear contact points, the sear/rail contact points, and hob-e-lube pure lithium grease is all thats needed.
Yeah, but some of the videos online show people taking that entire face off with a belt sander...
Laff.... There are alot of idiots on YT.
I didn't do anything to the face of the sear so I don't think that is the issue. I am also not sure I understand the explanation as given - but then I am a little slow.
The rails that the sear slides on do protrude a bit beyond the face of my sear. But I am not sure how that can be an issue. Those rails act as the stop for the trigger bar if the disconnector is not down enough. When the bolt is closed, the disconnector should push the trigger bar down below the rails and allow it to move and engage with the sear. So even if the sear is completely removed from the assembly, the trigger bar hits the rails if the bolt is not closed and locked. If the sear did extend past the end of the rails, that would not be a good thing in my estimation. Then the sear could be pushed by the trigger bar, at least partially, until the sear moved back to the point the face is flush with the rails. Then the trigger bar would contact the rails and stop. That movement might or might not be enough sear movement to release the hammer. Am I not understand the operation correctly?
I'm not real fond of the idea of pounding on the disconnector. I'll dry bending the end of the trigger bar down just so slightly. That should take care of it, I think! nailbite1
Thanks for the advise. I need to watch someone take that trigger assembly apart. I have a nice big bench vice. I laid the trigger assembly across the jaws with just enough of a crack between them to let the pin fall out. I wacked the trigger pin several times pretty hard with a 1/6 in. pin punch and the pin didn't move. I ended up bending the pin punch. Maybe it is just a cheap punch, ok, it is a cheap punch as I got it from Harbor Freight. Maybe I just need to get a high quality tempered punch and wack it a little harder. Any hints on how to get pins out without the use of a dremel tool? My thinking is that the pins are probably a bit mushroomed and that is why they won't come out. I was able to remove the mag release latch pin but I think that is the easiest one and I still had to hit it pretty hard to get it to move.
Thanks!
All good points... I would put a very tiny downward bend to the t-bar or swag the disconnecter.
If you can drift the pin any length to one side, you can lightly remove the mushroom and then drift out in the opposite direction.