SKS-FILES FORUM
SKS Carbines => Unaltered SKS Rifles => Romanian SKS => Topic started by: Boris Badinov on September 23, 2017, 11:11:34 AM
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Has this serial been resurfaced?
It's very smooth, no raised surfaces that are standard with stamping.
All metal matches. Stock is well worn, RC serial.
Original well worn romani sks sling.
CAI import. Romanian, Cugir.
(http://preview.ibb.co/kk62G5/20170923_105226.jpg) (http://ibb.co/cnhL3k)
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Ah... the mysterious PS prefix. usually these are not dated if you look at the serial charts, however some are.
In most of the ones I've seen photos of, they are what would I take to be the original stamps, given the oddity of this prefix, they may have used a different stamp method....... or.... maybe think1 like China, Russia sent Romania a train car full of bits and pieces to study and copy(like the SovietSino), and these were built and PS stamped, while the later native model followed normal Romanian prefixes. (Purely speculation there, I've not held one long enough to dig into the guts of it, BUT....we needs one, we wants one :)) )
Romania really had no known reason to grind them down and reserial units for super secret incognito missions, besides, they still have the Cugir stamp from what I've seen as well.. Even for refurb purposes, the history of the rifles show, they were not overly concerned with serial matching this and that.... they wanted a functioning good working rifle. Romania was a broke arse little nation, function was chosen over form and fluff, and I'm sure matching numbers don't really impress soldiers come go time, rifles that work, do.
If it is a Russian sent parts kit to Romania....maybe the PS prefix is a jab back at Russia.. PS = Piece-o-S*it rofl2 rofl2 chuckles1 I'm sorry.. but, it is kinda funny... rofl
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I'm fairly certain that it hasn't been scrubbed and re-stamped. It's just that the stamp itself is very smooth, and not as deep as stamps on other Romys-- like the raised edges of the stamps had been smoothe over. I didn't get a pic of the Romy Triangle but it's similarly shallow and very smooth.
Had to walk out of the shop to keep myself from buying it. May go back later today or tomorrow.
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I believe it to be a different stamping method/set of stamps, even the fonts change slightly as time progresses.. I think they changed stamps or stamp styles throughout manufacturing.
The 7 in 1957 is slightly different, on mine the 7 is slightly shorter than the 5 vs in the photo you show, even though both are a '57.
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/s/nap3z7eu6x2peqy/SAM_1218_zps2f3ad6f7.jpg?dl=0)
There are other changes in their stamps as well....another example... Note the number 4 on my 1958 vs the 4 on the one you posted, an open 4 vs a closed 4. The 3 is another difference from my '57 above, one has a rounded 3, the other a straight to 3..
(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/s/xm1xbv5ieak5dw9/SAM_1409_zps5e2abc9f.jpg?dl=0)
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Its tagged at $499. All metal parts match. Stock is 1960-- RC####. Wood is dirty as hell but relatively few dings.
And the original sling looks like it's been on the rifle since 1960.
My significant other is gonna kill me, but if its still there tomorrow--- i'm bringing it home. Will try to haggle the price down if possible.
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My significant other is gonna kill me, but if its still there tomorrow--- i'm bringing it home. Will try to haggle the price down if possible.
What..Jack Nicholson said it best.... if ya gotta go.......go with a smile. thumb1 Asking forgiveness is easier then asking permission.. the Enabler motto
Geeze.. you know how many times my.....................significant other has killed me, again and again over the many years of me dragging junk home. My neck snapped with.... I do chuckles1 you can't kill the dead. thumb1 rofl2 rofl2 chuckles1
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My significant other is gonna kill me, but if its still there tomorrow--- i'm bringing it home. Will try to haggle the price down if possible.
What..Jack Nicholson said it best.... if ya gotta go.......go with a smile. thumb1 Asking forgiveness is easier then asking permission.. the Enabler motto
Geeze.. you know how many times my.....................significant other has killed me, again and again over the many years of me dragging junk home. My neck snapped with.... I do chuckles1 you can't kill the dead. thumb1 rofl2 rofl2 chuckles1
:o
I have to agree that all of our neck's were snapped with the words of "I do". Some of us more than just once. rofl
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My significant other is gonna kill me, but if its still there tomorrow--- i'm bringing it home. Will try to haggle the price down if possible.
What..Jack Nicholson said it best.... if ya gotta go.......go with a smile. thumb1 Asking forgiveness is easier then asking permission.. the Enabler motto
Geeze.. you know how many times my.....................significant other has killed me, again and again over the many years of me dragging junk home. My neck snapped with.... I do chuckles1 you can't kill the dead. thumb1 rofl2 rofl2 chuckles1
:o
I have to agree that all of our neck's were snapped with the words of "I do". Some of us more than just once. rofl
So many things I could say..but I won't.. Me..... I can garandamntee it's a 1 time only ride, like the It's a Small World ride at Disney World. Fool me once, shame on you....fool me twice, shame on me, so I ain't getting fooled into that ride a second time. thumb1 rofl2 Renting and leasing come to mind :) rofl rofl2
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Yes, well. I'll be dying twice this week then. Because last night I purchased a hand select Beretta 92S from Classic.
T'was nice knowin y'all.
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My significant other is gonna kill me, but if its still there tomorrow--- i'm bringing it home. Will try to haggle the price down if possible.
What..Jack Nicholson said it best.... if ya gotta go.......go with a smile. thumb1 Asking forgiveness is easier then asking permission.. the Enabler motto
Geeze.. you know how many times my.....................significant other has killed me, again and again over the many years of me dragging junk home. My neck snapped with.... I do chuckles1 you can't kill the dead. thumb1 rofl2 rofl2 chuckles1
:o
I have to agree that all of our neck's were snapped with the words of "I do". Some of us more than just once. rofl
So many things I could say..but I won't.. Me..... I can garandamntee it's a 1 time only ride, like the It's a Small World ride at Disney World. Fool me once, shame on you....fool me twice, shame on me, so I ain't getting fooled into that ride a second time. thumb1 rofl2 Renting and leasing come to mind :) rofl rofl2
My Dad always told me, "Why buy the "cow" when you are getting the milk free?" I didnt listen the first time and paid dearly for my decision. I did listen the second time and did not get my neck snapped again. I didnt listen the third time. Luckily the third time is the keeper that I should have met and married so many years ago. :)
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or.... maybe think1 like China, Russia sent Romania a train car full of bits and pieces to study and copy(like the SovietSino), and these were built and PS stamped, while the later native model followed normal Romanian prefixes. (Purely speculation there)
The PS prefixes are definitely prime canidates for something like this. If BB does pull the trigger and gets it home, it'll be very interesting to see whether there's any Cyrillic *anywhere* on this thing, especially under the stock. One ding against it is the lack of the receiver star like is seen on the Soviet-Sinos. But this being '57, perhaps the Russians pulled these receivers out of a pile of destined-for-China hardware. Now that's some heavy duty speculation right there! chuckles1
Interesting differences in the S/N. when I'm next at the Computer I'll pull the other PS prefixes I have on file and maybe some other '57 prefixes and see what we see. If we can fund a transition, we may be able to tease something out.
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I didn't really look for any soviet features.
I was actually back on the fence about going back for it. After a bit of a sks binge year in 2016--I took a step back set myself a standard: All matching and/or unique variants only.
Is the prevailing concensus suggest that the PS series is the initial Romanian run of the M56?
I was only able to snap one other pic-- of the rear sight leaf. Battle setting "I".
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Sight leaf:
(http://preview.ibb.co/ckOKUQ/20170923_105257.jpg) (http://ibb.co/kzDxG5)
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...you can just make out an 'oval k' stamp on the barrel shank.
I i've seen that one on Soviet guns as well as the early chinese guns. But it's also on the two 1960 m56's I already have. And it was also on the Romanian M44 that I sold last year.
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It's possible that it could be a pressed stamp, and not a struck stamp.
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On the (K), tne thing I have noticed are barrel shank/proof marks on Romanians are shared with both Russian and earlier Chinese.. Also you also might find a (o) on them. Some of these same marks can be found on the Mosins again, typically M91/30, M44 and Type 53s, all 3, the Chinese, Russian and Romanians, even on the Romanian M1969 .22 trainer has them.
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Went back to the show this morning to pick it up...
Somebody else had already snagged it.
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Bummer. Ahh well, probably fir the best! I don't think there's general consensus PS's are the first. Known '57 prefixes are:
PS
AA
DE
The DE's stretch into 1958, though it is not clear whether the numbering restarts or if it's a smooth transition. I suspect it's a smooth transition and we have a couple corrupt data points. I'll look for photos and see what we find.
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cry2 cry2 skeered of dying twice.. rofl2 chuckles1 rofl
probably fir the best!
fir the best.... :o
RM... the point here is to.... ENABLE.. bring the vodka bottle to the AA meeting, bring the dime bag to rehab.....not the koolaid and not a salad... Not be all sappy and empathetic and promote missing an item or failing to purchase a gun. I mean....it's....it's a Romanian, it was not some factory /ou812\ 87 billion series Chinese chuckles1 I was almost giddy at the thought of seeing some PS prefix Romy guts splattered all over my screen.
But nooooo.. oh, it's probably fir the best ::) :P
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cry2 cry2 skeered of dying twice.. rofl2 chuckles1 rofl
probably fir the best!
fir the best.... :o
RM... the point here is to.... ENABLE.. bring the vodka bottle to the AA meeting, bring the dime bag to rehab.....not the koolaid and not a salad... Not be all sappy and empathetic and promote missing an item or failing to purchase a gun. I mean....it's....it's a Romanian, it was not some factory /ou812\ 87 billion series Chinese chuckles1 I was almost giddy at the thought of seeing some PS prefix Romy guts splattered all over my screen.
But nooooo.. oh, it's probably fir the best ::) :P
:o :o :o
clap1 clap1 clap1
rofl2 rofl2 rofl2
rofl rofl rofl
Now that right there is funny as all get out!
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fir?
The stock was pretty dirty, but I'm certain it was Beech. (Har, har)
I'm reminded of the 8 or so mismatched, absolutely-nothing-special, Chinese beaters that I jumped at with no questions asked last year, and I'm kickin' myself for hesitating yesterday on this Romanian beauty of a beast. Lesson learned. A mistake I will not make again.
Easily one of the more interesting/unique SKS carbines I've EVER encountered at the local shows.
It's not much of a consolation, but I still have a Beretta 92S to look forward to sneaking into the safe. So, there's that.
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My phone has issues (ok ok i have issues when posting on my phone) chuckles1
Commonly fat fingered words. Fir = for, tge = the, and abd = and. Happens so often it's obviously a bug in the phone doftware! rofl2
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My phone has issues (ok ok i have issues when posting on my phone) chuckles1
Commonly fat fingered words. Fir = for, tge = the, and abd = and. Happens so often it's obviously a bug in the phone doftware! rofl2
I smell..... deflection.. rofl
neither fir or for...still in the phrasing it is not enabling.... fat thumbed, misspelled 'er not, you were speaking in Appalachian dialect, you just didn't realize it fart1
Ok.. backwoods language lesson 101.....in my neck a tha woods.. "it's "for" the best" and 'it's "fir" the best" mean pert near the same thing..just like "get" and "git", "hill" and "heel".. what separates these two uses of the term from the same individual, is usually 6 to 7 beers and maybe a greasy pork samitch...
Now instead of looking at a super fine outstanding nude Romanian hottie.......it will be some Sicilian Mafia Fiat peperoni pizza pistol rofl2 All ya had to do was "make the seller an offer he couldn’t refuse" rofl2
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My phone has issues (ok ok i have issues when posting on my phone) chuckles1
Commonly fat fingered words. Fir = for, tge = the, and abd = and. Happens so often it's obviously a bug in the phone doftware! rofl2
I smell..... deflection.. rofl
neither fir or for...still in the phrasing it is not enabling.... fat thumbed, misspelled 'er not, you were speaking in Appalachian dialect, you just didn't realize it fart1
Ok.. backwoods language lesson 101.....in my neck a tha woods.. "it's "for" the best" and 'it's "fir" the best" mean pert near the same thing.. what separates these two uses of the term from the same individual, is usually 6 to 7 beers and maybe a greasy pork samitch...
Now instead of looking at a super fine outstanding nude Romanian hottie.......it will be some Sicilian Mafia Fiat peperoni pizza pistol rofl2 All ya had to do was "make the seller an offer he couldn’t refuse" rofl2
I smell something also but I dont think it is "deflection". I think it smells like something else. chuckles1
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Not much in the way of '57 guns. I'm surprised by the lack of photo evidence I have. (Boris, you have my permission to regret this one!) thumb1
Only other PS I have. An early undated gun:
(https://image.ibb.co/iBEuW5/PS0071_receiver.jpg)
AA's:
(https://image.ibb.co/hTotPQ/AA3941_receiver.jpg)
(https://image.ibb.co/fAXnjQ/AA2546_receiver.jpg)
Early DE's:
(https://image.ibb.co/knrzW5/DE34_receiver.jpg)
(https://image.ibb.co/dirBdk/DE1133_receiver.jpg)
(https://image.ibb.co/mke3r5/DE1576_receiver2.jpg)
Late DE's:
(https://image.ibb.co/fmgYr5/DE3975_receiver.jpg)
(https://image.ibb.co/jLvF4Q/DE4038_receiver.jpg)
(https://image.ibb.co/jnWoPQ/DE4881_receiver.jpg)
I'm going to say the '57 to '58 transition is somewhere between DE1500 and DE2000.
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Ahh one thing about the PS gun that BB posted earlier and the one I just posted myself that I just noticed...they have leading zeros. *None* of the other Romy's had *any* leading zeros that I'm aware of (see the DE34 example above)...
We know the Chinese used leading zeros in the Soviet-Sino series. It appears the PS series has similar pedigree. Very interesting. thumb1
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(Boris, you have my permission to regret this one!) thumb1
(https://image.ibb.co/dirBdk/DE1133_receiver.jpg)
Trust me, RM, the regret is deep. Yesterday morning the dealer was so certain that it wasn't going to sell he was already telling me he was willing to work with me on the price.
This morning when I went back, he said to me, "You're never gonna believe this, but it sold about five minutes after you walked away."
Of the early serials you posted above, the DE1133 is only one that resembles the contours of the PS in my initial post: no raised edges, the smooth appearance and the overall indication that strikes are shallow. The absence of the Romy arsenal triangle could be evidence that it has been polished. The arsenal stamp was very light on the PS rifle I posted as well.
Thanks for posting these pics.
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...good eye on the "0" place holders too.
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...hmmm.
Possibly an indicatation that the DE serial pre-dates the PS serials? --i.e. the absence of four digit place holders that was standard in subsequent serial ranges suggesting that the DE serials were stamped before the four digit standard had been established?
Also in line with the soviet practice of omitting place holders.
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I sure hope the Beretta hand select I have coming from Classic has a million dollar bill rolled up inside the barrel.
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...hmmm.
Possibly an indicatation that the DE serial pre-dates the PS serials? --i.e. the absence of four digit place holders that was standard in subsequent serial ranges suggesting that the DE serials were stamped before the four digit standard had been established?
Also in line with the soviet practice of omitting place holders.
I think you have it backwards. The rest of the Romys follow the Russian convention just like the DE's. PS is the outlier with the four digit/leading zeros.
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...hmmm.
Possibly an indicatation that the DE serial pre-dates the PS serials? --i.e. the absence of four digit place holders that was standard in subsequent serial ranges suggesting that the DE serials were stamped before the four digit standard had been established?
Also in line with the soviet practice of omitting place holders.
I think you have it backwards. The rest of the Romys follow the Russian convention just like the DE's. PS is the outlier with the four digit/leading zeros.
Ah. I see. Thanks for the clarification.
Now, I regret the missed opportunity even more.
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Ahh one thing about the PS gun that BB posted earlier and the one I just posted myself that I just noticed...they have leading zeros. *None* of the other Romy's had *any* leading zeros that I'm aware of (see the DE34 example above)...
We know the Chinese used leading zeros in the Soviet-Sino series. It appears the PS series has similar pedigree. Very interesting. thumb1
With the exception of Romanian built Aks....this could be due to so many being commercial built imports vs ones actually sporting a true blue Ak built from a chopped up automatic rifle. Out of all the Romanian M44s and TTCs, I have yet to see one that has leading zeros(like the SKS, I haven't seen every serial :) ).. Both of these weapons typically marked like the SKS, 2 letter prefix, xxxx serial and then year of mfg. Also near as I have seen, the M1969 trainer follows suit with no leading zero, slight difference, like the Mosin, it's usually barrel shank stamped, year above the serial. The difference is usually a single letter prefix followed by xxx number. The Vz24 Romanian contract rifles also sport the double letter prefix and xxxx serial, while this follows the above trend, it's not a native built weapon.
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UPDATE:
Just FEI : still acutely regretting not jumping on this purchase when the rifle was in my hands.
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UPDATE:
Just FEI : still acutely regretting not jumping on this purchase when the rifle was in my hands.
Hurts a little don't. :) There will be another...and another...and another..
Both another rifle and another regret... there are bunches of both waiting to be found around every corner. thumb1 Lord knows I have a few... er.. metric crap ton.
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UPDATE:
Just FEI : still acutely regretting not jumping on this purchase when the rifle was in my hands.
rofl That happens occasionally, although my bank account says it very rarely happens.
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Missing a purchase ain't too bad... now when your at a gunshow and something raises your drawers, but you want to keep looking, 5 minutes later, you see some hamhock walking around with what you just looked at, the same item that moved your pants fart1 ...or when you sell something....then truly regret it....then you ending up buying a different one back for more.. that really sucks.. or missing an auction by a fricken dollar fifty...thats a real piss ripper rofl2 chuckles1
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Missing a purchase ain't too bad... now when your at a gunshow and something raises your drawers, but you want to keep looking, 5 minutes later, you see some hamhock walking around with what you just looked at, the same item that moved your pants fart1 ...or when you sell something....then truly regret it....then you ending up buying a different one back for more.. that really sucks.. or missing an auction by a fricken dollar fifty...thats a real piss ripper rofl2 chuckles1
Man, aint that the truth! Been there, done that! :(
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In full commiseration mode, I went ahead and added another slice of-- how did GM put it?-- "Sicilian Mafia Fiat pepperoni pizza pistol".
92s showed up today.
Closed the deal this morning on an a VG 85f direct from RGuns. 8+1 in .380acp.
Should be here Tuesday.
For surplus pistols-- I'm really digging the recent Beretta Italian service turn-ins.
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think1 hummm.. well... from an Enablers point of view..... sounds like your drowning your sorrows, replacing a loss with what you interpret as a gain.... ya done got all down in the dumps, feeling begrudgingly miserable, hating yourself, regretting your past indiscretion, suffering...all alone through the withdrawal D.T.s, shivers and sweats, loss of sleep, that sickly feeling....hoping to pacify it by substituting super great type of fix for another fix of lesser feeling, and then weakly justifying it in the end.....classic sign of mid/late addiction symptoms.. aww damn... I'm outta bourbon.. oh, lookie, here's a light beer, it will do.... I guess cry1 chuckles1
We're here for ya buddy thumb1 rofl2
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think1 Hmm, I need one of those Beretta 92s... doh1
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think1 Hmm, I need one of those Beretta 92s... doh1
Wait til a new batch comes in. Then jump on the hand select option asap.
I opted for the hand select knowing that the last Classic batch arrived in late July. I got a decent piece-- but it ain't one of the NIB-looking pieces that they were pulling out of the crate in YouTube vid when the batch first arrived.
I'll post pics of it when I the 85f arrives next week....because I sure as Hell ain't gonna be posting any pics of the early 1957, all-metal-matching, Romanian M56 , PS serial with original Romanian sling that I screwed the pooch on. dash2
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Pooch screwer.... rofl
See... I go and buy a cheap Egyptian copy of one of them there Italian pistols..no "Sicilian Mafia Fiat pepperoni pizza pistol" for me... I get a sand infused hunk-a-King Tutankhamun's finest single stack camel dung shooter.. rofl2 rofl chuckles1
But...I got a matching '57 Romanian already
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Pooch screwer.... rofl
See... I go and buy a cheap Egyptian copy of one of them there Italian pistols..no "Sicilian Mafia Fiat pepperoni pizza pistol" for me... I get a sand infused hunk-a-King Tutankhamun's finest single stack camel dung shooter.. rofl2 rofl chuckles1
But...I got a matching '57 Romanian already
Oh wow! :o
Pooch screwing and camel dung shooters all in one post. :))
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think1 hummm.. well... from an Enablers point of view.....
We're here for ya buddy thumb1 rofl2
ROFL, Dammit GM, you're going to give the guy an aneurism! I'm sure he feels bad enough, no need to heap it on. (although if I was heaping it on and he would have mentioned the original Romy sling in the first place, I would have been all like drool2 doh1 cry2)
I can freely admit I have many a regret in the firearms trade (though not a single one of them a Mosin chuckles1). Missing out on the PSA VZ2008s for $399 though...gah that one just kills me. ireful1
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Sorry RM.. Wish I could claim that.. but I digress. twas not me behind the keyboard.. was that little rat bastard Katy Perry lovin fiend :))
Dammit Jimmy :o your gonna cause him to pop a brain vessel..be nice.
but wait.......go read Mr. Badinov's opening post. 4th line down...he openly admitted and stated there was a sling included in the package from the get go..
Original well worn romani sks sling.
So.. a Romanian leather dominatrix whip sling, super sexy matchy drawers raising Romanian with PowerSurges initials mashed in it in some weird format.. Jimmy is justified in the hardtime and should be vindicated of charges... thumb1
Yeah those Vz2008 are nice... :P Still I say you need a Mosin....but I cant get no donations...the RM Needs a Mosin GoFundMe is dryer than a popcorn fart. rofl2
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Let us see now. So far we have pooch screwing, camel dung shooters, a little rat bastard Katy Perry lovin fiend, and to top it all off, we now have dry popcorn farts! What is next? rofl
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Laugh! Jimmy I cry your pardon. Totally missed the sling in the OP. Though with a tag at $499, how much lower would this gun have gone? I don't think I would have pulled the trigger at 5 Benjamins for a replacement stock Romy...even if it was a PS prefix. thumb1
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I'd say it's very close to market.. 50-90 dollar hard sling to find thrown in..leaves 410-450ish for the rifle, a little on the high side, but one might have been able to go and throw 475 in green bills on the counter and scream OTD, going once...going twice. BS and green paper talks and BB coulda walked...but any lower for a slung Romy.. I think would have been an unobtainable lowball to an educated seller.. So there might have been a little wiggle room....just very little.
I'm sure the seller had figured in cost of the sling.. that kind of nullifies the mismatchy stock....the serial prefix.. the seller possibly had no clue unless he researched that. Surprised the seller didn't go a little retard.. put said rifle on the sales floor for 499....throw the sling on an auction site for 50-75 bucks...raising his end profit.
oh well... no use crying over spilled milk...or missed Romanians.. :)