Author Topic: Italian Vetterli M70/87/15  (Read 3982 times)

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Offline Greasemonkey

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Italian Vetterli M70/87/15
« on: November 08, 2017, 09:32:29 PM »
It's another oldie, one that saw use well into WWII, and several changes... Made in the 1870s at the Torino Arms Factory in Turin, Italy, as a singleshot 10.35x47Rmm blackpowder round, Italy redesigned the mag for enblocs in 1887.. then Italy changed to the 6.5 Carcano on 1891 and the M91 Carcano came on the scene, these rifles faded in to obscurity.. Fast forward to 1915... WWI gets cranked.. Italy is caught with limited small arms, so they dust off and drag out these already 40+year rifles. Now in a poor nation with limited resources they took these 10.35mm barrels and relined them to 6.5mm, a process known as the Salerno method. Now if one is really up to date on older stuff, Finland used this same method on P series Mosins in the 1920's. A slight alteration to the magazine allowed the use of the 6.5mm round and enbloc clip.

These were in Italy mostly issued to rear line troops after their modifications, more like an emergency last ditch weapon, but, they found their way and were used during the Italian invasion on Ethiopia, they have even been found to be used during WWII. So for, by the time WWII rolled around, they were already pushing 70 years old, it's a rifle that literally has been around the block. Most have probably seen quite a bit of use, which given the questionable strength of the weapon is both shocking and kind of a testament to workmanship back in the early days.

This one takes the cake for my longest barreled rifle, the barrel it's self measures in at 33 1/4 inches.. it's almost 54 inches long, and weighs just over 9 pounds. Capacity is 6rds.

Would I shoot it.. probably not, like my Swiss Vetterli, I think this 140'ish year old veteran has earned the right to be retired.  thumb1











You van see where the modification for the more narrow magazine was done on the stock, they filled in around it.


I'm going to make him an offer he can't refuse......

Leave the gun, take the cannoli.

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Offline newchi

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Re: Italian Vetterli M70/87/15
« Reply #1 on: November 08, 2017, 09:56:42 PM »
needs a bayonet if you ask me  :)
I bet it would look good with one, it was made in the pike vs cavalry era

Offline Greasemonkey

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Re: Italian Vetterli M70/87/15
« Reply #2 on: November 08, 2017, 10:01:35 PM »
Bayonet... think1.. give me time, besides, whats another 20-22 added inches in overall length.  :)
I'm going to make him an offer he can't refuse......

Leave the gun, take the cannoli.

I said I was an addict........I didn't say I had a problem

Online Phosphorus32

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Re: Italian Vetterli M70/87/15
« Reply #3 on: November 08, 2017, 10:26:40 PM »
Definitely an old war horse  that has earned its retirement  :o  thumb1

I can see where the Carcanos got their sights from, or is that a sight added for the 6.5x52 round? I really don't know much about the Vetterlis.

Offline Greasemonkey

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Re: Italian Vetterli M70/87/15
« Reply #4 on: November 08, 2017, 11:07:58 PM »
Good question on the sight.. I don't really know.. I would imagine it would at least had to be recalibrated.


This is the rear sight on my Swiss Vetterli from the same era.. it is still in its original caliber. It's out to 1200meters..for the smaller 10.4x38mmR round.

I'm going to make him an offer he can't refuse......

Leave the gun, take the cannoli.

I said I was an addict........I didn't say I had a problem

Offline Loose}{Cannon

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Re: Italian Vetterli M70/87/15
« Reply #5 on: November 09, 2017, 09:32:59 AM »
No balls...  Cannon would shoot it.   rofl

I like this Swiss thingy.  Show off that one.
      
1776 will commence again if you try to take our firearms... It doesn't matter how many Lenins you get out on the street begging for them to be taken.

Offline Greasemonkey

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Re: Italian Vetterli M70/87/15
« Reply #6 on: November 09, 2017, 12:08:06 PM »
No balls...  Cannon would shoot it.   rofl

I like this Swiss thingy.  Show off that one.

I would if I could find or load down loaded 6.5mm Carcano.. The pressure difference between the larger black powder and smaller smokeless round is quite a difference..  However... if'en your feeling particularly testicular swollen.. feel free to come on up, I will supply you with a box of 6.5mm Carcano and let you have a go. thumb1

These are the bolt lugs, 3 total.. now while they did upgrade several other things, these and the receiver were not changed. These are the same bolt lugs that were used with the 10.4×47mmR round.




As for the other....Swiss thingy ::)  it's a Swiss Model 1869/71 Vetterli, made by Eidgenössische Montier-Werstätte in Bern. Out of the 114,000 rifles made, Montier-Werstätte made a total of 8,900 1869/71 rifles from 1872 to 1875. It's a tube fed bolt action, holds 11 rounds, it loads like a modern lever action, it's like a hybrid bolt/lever action. It is one of the largest rimfire weapons, and one of the few that ever saw military field service outside of small trainers.

It's a hair smaller, barrel is 33 inches long, overall length is roughly 51 inches, but it weighs about 10.5 pounds.. the added tube magazine and more complex action added some weight.










And.....this is 41 Swiss Rimfire ammo.... or 10.4x38mmR, commercial ammo such as this was made till around 1942 or so..

« Last Edit: November 09, 2017, 12:34:24 PM by Greasemonkey »
I'm going to make him an offer he can't refuse......

Leave the gun, take the cannoli.

I said I was an addict........I didn't say I had a problem

Offline Loose}{Cannon

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Re: Italian Vetterli M70/87/15
« Reply #7 on: November 09, 2017, 12:28:26 PM »
Connon like the Swiss thingy.   thumb1

The Sasquatch foot.... not so much.   :o
      
1776 will commence again if you try to take our firearms... It doesn't matter how many Lenins you get out on the street begging for them to be taken.