1969 Albanian Model 561

[firstchoice]

  I'm going to say that this is an "as-issued", per RM's grading guidelines. Look through the pics, and if anyone sees anything that says otherwise, please post up. I'm not the best at taking pics, so if the pics need redoing, let me know that too.



  I received two great condition Alby Chest Pouches, two of the Alby Oilers, and two greasy/dirty Chinese-type slings with leather loops with this rifle. I didn't get any belt-type ammo pouches. I don't know if they used them there, or not? I'll take pics of the Chest Pouches, Oilers, and Slings and add them to this thread, later.

  It has the TGI import stamp under the barrel, as can be seen partially in the 7th pic down. If a clear pic of the Import Stamp is needed, let me know. She's still packed full of Cosmoline. I've never popped the stock off of it. Just field stripped it to take these pics. I did push the cosmoline out of the barrel and the rifling looks great. I've had this one for quite a while and have yet to get an opinion on it. What do you guys think?

firstchoice

[running-man]

It's a beautiful gun FC, a really nice looker! 

'As-Issued' is certainly what I'd classify the arsenal condition.  With the EP'd parts, like the rear sight ladder and the extractor, I don't think you'll find a consensus about whether it may have gone through a refurb or not (nor do I think we could even begin to comment on Albanian refurb practices in the first place).  Regardless, the 'as-issued' certainly encompasses what this gun is without getting lost in the contentious weeds of 'unissued', 'unrefurbished', and 'unfired'.

If this was one of the auction guns I was evaluating, it would get a bit of a current condition ding from the bolt carrier handle inflicted gouge marks in the stock near the right crossbolt and for a bit of minor shellac flaking. That grain on the right side of the buttstock is simply awesome though.  The bluing on it looks quite good too with maybe a bit of loss around the edges of say the RSL or the bottom of the recever cover slide.  Nitpicking at it's finest in all honesty because I'm not seeing much I don't like about it at all! . 

This gun is a current condition 'Good' by itself, and could even qualify in the 'Very Good' category with all the accessories you've got listed with it.  From what I've seen it's easily a top 10% gun out of all Albys located within the US here.  That black stripe on the left side of the stock is pretty unique too.  You simply don't see many like this and I can see why you decided to hang onto it as well as keep it in the grease. 

[Justin Hell]

I really like that stock, it certainly has some grain character to it for sure!

Do Albanian gas tubes have more ventilation holes? The sixth picture down seems to show three on the one side?

[firstchoice]

Thanks RM. Yeah, and at least one of those Bolt Carrier gouge marks was done by a Chinese, or possibly Russian, SKS, too! The blasphemy! 

  Three of the 1969 Alby's that I've seen have had a different grain to them, as compared to the other years of original  numbered Alby's.
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=502590041
Albanian SKS Porn in Albanian SKS - Page 1 of 1
(and mine)
  It's probably just a coincidence.

Justin, Yep, I like the grain too. It's one of those stocks that you wish you had got it when it was new. No way I'd ever refinish it, though. On the Gas Ports, GM had a post here:

Thoughts on the Albanian SKS in Albanian SKS - Page 1 of 2

--where he stated: "It was explained to me the 6 port gas tube was a durability upgrade. Truth, no clue, but I'm sure those 6 ports can exhaust the air out of the gas tube faster when fired, it also acts as a redundant in case one or more ports gets plugged."

There's three ports on each side.

firstchoice

[Justin Hell]

Interesting...perhaps it was an attempt to make it run cooler? It seems like it would gradually reduce pressure and ultimately lend to cycling problems...but perhaps there is plenty of energy.

Maybe that is why they extended the handguard, to allow for more rapid fire encounters without heat issues?

I have never held an Albanian, but am surprised by that feature, gotta love learning something new about SKSs nearly every day.

[Greasemonkey]

Interesting...perhaps it was an attempt to make it run cooler? It seems like it would gradually reduce pressure and ultimately lend to cycling problems...but perhaps there is plenty of energy.

Ok, maybe this will make a little more sense

You gotta remember, the piston never passes the gas tube ports, unlike an Ak piston, an SKS gas piston only moves about 3/4 to maybe an inch during a firing impulse. The gas piston travel is limited by the op rod and spring, which is limited by the bolt carrier weight and the bolt is locked and a large spring. It's all just a very short, very quick and strong impulse to unlock the bolt and a combination of remaining chamber pressures and the short quick slap from the piston makes the whole mess work in tandem. The ports just dump the air behind the piston on firing and allow it too draw air in when the piston is resetting for the next shot. A tube vent, basically. The excess gases in front of the piston, now a lower pressure cooler gas would mostly escape back through the barrel gas port and slight amount of leakage between the tube and gas block. 

Gas tube ports have little if any effect on actual firing, as long as they are not plugged and vented to the atmosphere. The actual gas port in the gas block and barrel, thats a completely different story, making that smaller or larger can alter operation of the gas system.

[Loose}{Cannon]

Yup.

[Justin Hell]

I guess I got the back pressure concept backwards in my mind...seems as if your op rod and spring would take an additional beating with the reduced pressure on the back side of the piston. As far forward as those seem to be, it looked to me as if it would actually go past at least the first one.  I had never noticed that feature on the Alby tubes, nor do I think I ever read about it either....they have so many weird features I guess looking at the gas tube is like taking out my contacts and looking at it underwater. 

My guitar collection fears the day an Albanian shows up in Montana. Their funkiness is so appealing.

It is like the Mercury Capri to the Ford Mustang...functions the same, just with a couple of cosmetic differences to keep the replacement parts higher priced and harder to find.

[Phosphorus32]

Yes sir, that's a very nice looking Albanian   

They've got so many differences from the others that they're increasingly piquing my interest. 

It's like I can feel Gollum sitting in the back of one of Hoxha's bunkers calling, "my precious" 

[Loose}{Cannon]

Yes sir, that's a very nice looking Albanian   

They've got so many differences from the others that they're increasingly piquing my interest. 

It's like I can feel Gollum sitting in the back of one of Hoxha's bunkers calling, "my precious" 

Yup...  Your screwed.   

[Greasemonkey]

It's like I can feel Gollum sitting in the back of one of Hoxha's bunkers calling, "my precious" 

We wants it, we needs it. Must have the precious.  They taunt us with its, the sneaky little Albanianses. Wicked, tricksy, false!


Just do it!!  Gotta balance out the Yugoslavian gluttonous binge you've been on, move to the other end of the alphabet...

[Phosphorus32]

Yup...  Your screwed.   

I'm being patient. The pickings are slim and the pockets are empty, at the moment.

Just do it!!  Gotta balance out the Yugoslavian gluttonous binge you've been on, move to the other end of the alphabet...

SKSs from Albania to Zastava, hmm  Thorin speaks wisely 

[Greasemonkey]

I guess I got the back pressure concept backwards in my mind...seems as if your op rod and spring would take an additional beating with the reduced pressure on the back side of the piston. As far forward as those seem to be, it looked to me as if it would actually go past at least the first one.  I had never noticed that feature on the Alby tubes, nor do I think I ever read about it either....they have so many weird features I guess looking at the gas tube is like taking out my contacts and looking at it underwater. 

Technically, the gas tube itself is not even required in this style gas system.  A Vz58 uses a spring loaded gas piston but has no gas tube per-say or op rod. Now, before one says it's totally different, the gas system and piston works identical between the Vz and SKS, the piston assembly directly unlocks the Vz58 bolt carrier. The Czechs used a highly simplified short stroke gas system, virtually identical to the SKS, and adapted it for automatic fire, instead of dumping gases back into the barrel, they simply got vented under the handguard.





Vz gas piston vs an Ak. The Vz is much like a SKS piston/spring loaded op rod all rolled into one.



Now the little issue with the Czech design, do a few mag dumps, the handguard gets kinda toasty, rather quick, even with a heat shield installed. Which, could be why Albania made the handguard full length and added extra ventilation to circulate a larger volume of cooler fresh air. But, again it's just a theory. 

Was Albania concerned with ergonomics? soldier safety? or maybe the three ports per side, and Ak style charging handle, make it appear more Ak'ish to the soldiers? These are plausible, but maybe unlikely  Or, was it as simple as make it look as close to a Type 63 as possible, Albania being a big user of this weapon. Maybe they liked the looks, from a distance I would imagine they look the same, even close up, they share some visual similarities.  Handguard appearance, double hole butt stock, Type 63 looks mixed with SKS durability, as the Type 63 wasn't really noted for it's durability.  The Chinese T63 And Its Role In Jianshe T56 Production in Chinese SKS (Military) - Page 1 of 2

[Power Surge]

I guess I got the back pressure concept backwards in my mind...seems as if your op rod and spring would take an additional beating with the reduced pressure on the back side of the piston. As far forward as those seem to be, it looked to me as if it would actually go past at least the first one.  I had never noticed that feature on the Alby tubes, nor do I think I ever read about it either....they have so many weird features I guess looking at the gas tube is like taking out my contacts and looking at it underwater. 

Technically, the gas tube itself is not even required in this style gas system.  A Vz58 uses a spring loaded gas piston but has no gas tube per-say or op rod. Now, before one says it's totally different, the gas system and piston works identical between the Vz and SKS, the piston assembly directly unlocks the Vz58 bolt carrier. The Czechs used a highly simplified short stroke gas system, virtually identical to the SKS, and adapted it for automatic fire, instead of dumping gases back into the barrel, they simply got vented under the handguard.





Vz gas piston vs an Ak. The Vz is much like a SKS piston/spring loaded op rod all rolled into one.



Now the little issue with the Czech design, do a few mag dumps, the handguard gets kinda toasty, rather quick, even with a heat shield installed. Which, could be why Albania made the handguard full length and added extra ventilation to circulate a larger volume of cooler fresh air. But, again it's just a theory. 

Was Albania concerned with ergonomics? soldier safety? or maybe the three ports per side, and Ak style charging handle, make it appear more Ak'ish to the soldiers? These are plausible, but maybe unlikely  Or, was it as simple as make it look as close to a Type 63 as possible, Albania being a big user of this weapon. Maybe they liked the looks, from a distance I would imagine they look the same, even close up, they share some visual similarities.  Handguard appearance, double hole butt stock, Type 63 looks mixed with SKS durability, as the Type 63 wasn't really noted for it's durability.  The Chinese T63 And Its Role In Jianshe T56 Production in Chinese SKS (Military) - Page 1 of 2

Like an SVT40 also.... Little gas piston and cup at the front, and then a 2ft long exposed operating rod back to the action rod. Just covered by the long hand guard.

[firstchoice]

Finally getting around to adding pics of the Alby Chest Pouches, Oilers, and the Slings that came with the 1969 Albanian SKS pictured above. The Chest pouches I "know", (pretty sure), are the correct ones. I've seen so many variations of Alby Oilers, I don't know which is actually "correct". The slings that came with it were the Chinese variety, but I like them.







  I was sent two sets of everything on this deal. The two pouches are pretty close to the same color, with exception of the tie downs and the interior was a bit lighter color on one.



  The pics of the oilers aren't that great. The weather here has sucked and indoor pics with black plastic is not my forte. I received two of the shorter type (abt. 2 3/4") and two that were about an inch longer, (abt. 3 3/4"). I also have a couple that are a light brown/beige in color, but couldn't find them to include them in these pics. (Yah, I know, "pics, or it didn't happen."    )
 








 This one's a little wonky, but it works.



  The slings are in good shape other than the wear and tear on the leather tabs. One sling is a bit wider and shaded a bit different. All in all, they have "character". 









  Did the Albanians' issue any belt carried ammo pouches?

firstchoice

[Greasemonkey]

The oiler that came with one of mine was identical, but a clear orangish plastic, like the stock finish color, and the sling, well it smells horrible. Not the usual pleasant surplus smell, more like bloated swelled in the sun roadkill.

[MEBears]

Congratulations! I've been looking at everything Albanian I can find the last week and that has to be one of the nicest I've seen You lucked out getting the accessories. The slings and oilers are nowhere to be found.

[Loose}{Cannon]

I bought a leather pouch similar to the early chinese from a distributor (cant remember who) that was list as Albanian.  I had asked them how they knew it was albanian and they told me thats where they came from. In addition, I found there were no chinese stamps on the inside like the similar Chinese.   The stitching on the one I have is also larger. Its like they copied the chinese pouch like they did the chest rig.

[Loose}{Cannon]

Here it is next to the romanian.

[Phosphorus32]

Finally getting around to adding pics of the Alby Chest Pouches, Oilers, and the Slings that came with the 1969 Albanian SKS pictured above. The Chest pouches I "know", (pretty sure), are the correct ones. I've seen so many variations of Alby Oilers, I don't know which is actually "correct". The slings that came with it were the Chinese variety, but I like them.

firstchoice

Nice cache of accessories you got there FC!   

Here it is next to the romanian.

Cool     Looks very sturdy.

Accessories and oilers and slings, oh my.    I've got some holes to fill in the collecting department.

I don't have an Albanian helmet either...dang!