Chinese Made, Albanian Used SKS

[Ret-Sarge]

IO Inc Palm Bay, Florida. It's stamped on the right side of the barrel, below rhe handguard and gas tube assembly.

Very nice.  That's identical to a 2014 import stamp.  It's highly likely that this is a relatively old gun that was initially wholesaled and stored (or stored then wholesaled), and finally sold at retail in your LGS.  Haven't seen those IOs at retail for a good long while and I've only seen FOXTROT, PW, and IARMS stamps on the current batch of 10-13 mil /26\s Sino-Banians.   

The stock is most certainly a Chinese stock.  May very well be the original stock for the gun, the font size is correct for a ghost even if it not legible.  The wood is not beech which would be a dead giveaway that it was an Alby replacement. 

I'd be a little wary of using what's under the buttplate to determine a whole lot.  You can literally find almost anything back there:

Early 2 mil /26\ Chinese w/ original stock:




A late ghost with a replacement Russian laminated stock that was renumbered by the Albanians (don't see this very often at all):




A mid-ghost, this time having an unnumbered Albanian replacement stock.  In the second photo, you can see the telltale 'fish scale flecks' that are the dead giveaway:



A true Albanian (unfortunately bubba got to this one) missing the buttplate:



Here is what the cavity of a true Albanian looks like in detail:


Finally, I have two Albanian stocks for Albanian Model 561 SKS (two stocks on either side), and an a Albanian stock that was made to fit an early blade Chinese type 56 (center).  You can see the differences in the swivel placement and the cavities in the rear of the stock. 

Thank you for the education and confirmation on it being a Chinese stock.

I picked this gun up in May of 2015, and it was still slathered in cosmoline. The bolt was literally a block of grease, the firing pin wouldn't move at all, the gas tube was the same way. Took a lot of cleaning over a few days to get her clean. I left the stock hanging in the shed over a bucket for two days to cook some of the grease out of it. It had close to 1/2 of grease in it when I was done.

[running-man]

Thank you for the education and confirmation on it being a Chinese stock.

I picked this gun up in May of 2015, and it was still slathered in cosmoline. The bolt was literally a block of grease, the firing pin wouldn't move at all, the gas tube was the same way. Took a lot of cleaning over a few days to get her clean. I left the stock hanging in the shed over a bucket for two days to cook some of the grease out of it. It had close to 1/2 of grease in it when I was done.

Ahh, I had misunderstood that you picked it up recently!    They were pretty gnarly to clean, I still have one that I'm waiting for the weather to warm up before I tackle myself!

[running-man]

I have read that a lot of the Chinese stocks are made from Catalpa wood. The Albanian stocks are longer and would be cut back in the front when fitted to a Chinese SKS. My Chinese/Albanian was imported by GCI in Knox County Tennessee. I purchased mine in 2017 from J&G. I think my stock is a Chinese stock but there are no serial numbers on it.

You have an Albanian replacement stock made to fit a T56 on yours, the grain is unmistakable.  Cut down Albanian stocks meant for Model 561 Albanian SKSs are uncommon, but they are around and they have the large cavity (and usually a 2 hole buttplate) at the rear.  You can typically tell them a mile away because they fit pretty poorly at the front ferrule too:



Here are the Alby 561 vs T56 stocks side by side, you can see where the cutdown would have to happen to make the longer 561 stocks fit (note the 561 stocks will always be side swivel):


Here's my first Sino-Banian right after unboxing in 2012 when we didn't know 1/10th of what we knew today...basically the gun that started me on my journey to research them:

[Ret-Sarge]

Thank you for all the information being given here, as for the "Hijacking" of my thread I don't see it happening in my opinion. People are asking legitimate questions and we have some very knowledgeable people giving us answers.

The purpose of these forums is to share our finds, for us "Dummies" like me to ask questions, for the "Smart ones" to answer those questions. If we all can't share in the excitement of the finds, the sharing of knowledge and the learning that happens we are in the wrong place.

Thank you for all the people that have posted thus far........

[Ret-Sarge]

Thank you for the education and confirmation on it being a Chinese stock.

I picked this gun up in May of 2015, and it was still slathered in cosmoline. The bolt was literally a block of grease, the firing pin wouldn't move at all, the gas tube was the same way. Took a lot of cleaning over a few days to get her clean. I left the stock hanging in the shed over a bucket for two days to cook some of the grease out of it. It had close to 1/2 of grease in it when I was done.

Ahh, I had misunderstood that you picked it up recently!    They were pretty gnarly to clean, I still have one that I'm waiting for the weather to warm up before I tackle myself!

Yeah like I said life, health and Hurricane Michael got in the way. Was looking at gun sites in my gun folder seeing which were still active and I found this one. Found out that I only did a post on my numbers matching Romanian M44,  but never the SKS. One the reason I joined this site was to learn more about my SKS. Duh call me a dummy.......

My little gun collection thus far, if there is anything you'd or anyone would like to see let me know.

Pistols:

1933 Tula/Nagant Model 1895
1953 Ceskoslovenska Zbrojovka BRNO CZ-52 / VZ-52
197? JP Sauer & Sohn/Hawes Western Marshall
1991 Ceská Zbrojovka CZ-83
1991 Ceská Zbrojovka CZ-83
1979 Armi San Marco Colt 1851 Navy
2013 Taurus PT 111 Millennium G2
2013 SCCY CPX-1 CB
2013 SCCY CPX-1 TT

Long Guns:

1863 Snider Enfield P1853 Mk II** Afghanistan Bringback
1879 Waffen Fabrik Bern Swiss Vetterli Model 1869/71
1890 Danzig Commission Rifle Model 1888 aka Gew 88
1894/1927 Izhevsk/Tikkakoski/Mosin-Nagant Model 1891
1894-1896 Oviedo/Mauser (Spanish) Model 1893
1914 Koishikawa Arsenal Type 38 Arisaka
1915-1917/1924-1927 Remington/Böhler Stahl/Mosin-Nagant Model 1891/24
1917 Tula/Mosin-Nagant Model 1891
1918/1932 Steyr Mannlicher M1895/30
1920-1926 Oviedo/Mauser (Spanish) M1893/1916
1926-1928 Fabrique Nationale d'armes de Guerre M1924/47
1928-1930 Ceskoslovenska Zbrojovka VZ-24 (1932 San Paulo uprising gun)
1929-1941 Kragujevac Arsenal M1924/47
1932 Izhevsk/Mosin-Nagant Model 1891/30
1939 Tula/Mosin-Nagant Model 1891/30
1940-1956 Iver Johnson Arms & Cycle Works Champion
1942 K. Kale/Mauser (Turkish) Model 1938
1942 Izhevsk/Mosin-Nagant 1891/30
1943 Springfield Armory Garand M1
1943 Izhevsk/Mosin-Nagant Model 1891/30
1943 BSA Shirley M47 Enfield No. 4 Mk 1
1944 Nagoya Arsenal Type 99 Arisaka
1944 Waffen Werke Brunn K98k Mauset (Dot 44)
1947 Izhevsk/Mosin-Nagant Model 1944
1948-1949 Manufacture d'armes de Saint Etienne MAS-1936
1948-1952 Kragujevac Arsenal M1948
1954 Romanian Mosin Nagant Model 1944
1955 Chongquing Arsenal Type 53
1956 Jianshe Arsenal Sino-Soviet SKS M56
1973 Marlin Original Golden-39M
1975 Remington 1100
2015 Mossberg Int'l 702 Plinkster
2016 Bushmaster XM15-E2S (AR15A2)
2018 Cugir Arms Factory WASR 10 AKM

[Bacarnal]

Nice collection, RS!!

[Larry D.]

Sarge - I could get to hate you...

I've been looking all over the place for months for a CZ83 and here you have 2 of them......

[Ret-Sarge]

Sarge - I could get to hate you...

I've been looking all over the place for months for a CZ83 and here you have 2 of them......

We bought two of them brand new in 1992 while stationed at Rhein Main AB, Germany. I get a shotgun pattern at 30 feet with it, my wife gets a soda can size circle at 30 feet with rapid fire.

My father in law has one of them right now, he borrowed it and fell in love with it.  We paid $249.94 each for them. They are Czech made versus US made, and have no import marks. We still have all the paperwork for them.

Paperwork we have for both of them.

Original purchase receipt
AE Form 190-6A (Firearms Retention Authorization)
AE Form 190-6C-R (Notification Of Firearm(s) Purchase)
ATF From 6 (Application And Permit For Importation Of Fireams, Ammunition And Implements Of War)
Original box w/ cleaning brush, factory test target, and engineering Inspection slip from CZ, along with both original 12 round magazines.

Here's a link to some pics of them.

https://sks-files.com/index.php?topic=4860.0

 

[B.B. Babington]

I want to give a big shout out to SKSFiles.  Kudos guys.  Those 2 links to Yooper in this thread went in April 1 and still there 10 days later.  I posted a link to a Yooper pic on another forum, and it was corrupted by forum admin (or Yooper) in just 2 days.  This shows who's more concerned with scholarship and info exchange.  Great job guys.

[Gashog]

I have read that a lot of the Chinese stocks are made from Catalpa wood. The Albanian stocks are longer and would be cut back in the front when fitted to a Chinese SKS. My Chinese/Albanian was imported by GCI in Knox County Tennessee. I purchased mine in 2017 from J&G. I think my stock is a Chinese stock but there are no serial numbers on it.

You have an Albanian replacement stock made to fit a T56 on yours, the grain is unmistakable.  Cut down Albanian stocks meant for Model 561 Albanian SKSs are uncommon, but they are around and they have the large cavity (and usually a 2 hole buttplate) at the rear.  You can typically tell them a mile away because they fit pretty poorly at the front ferrule too:



Here are the Alby 561 vs T56 stocks side by side, you can see where the cutdown would have to happen to make the longer 561 stocks fit (note the 561 stocks will always be side swivel):


Here's my first Sino-Banian right after unboxing in 2012 when we didn't know 1/10th of what we knew today...basically the gun that started me on my journey to research them:

I am now a bit confused. You stated I had an Albanian replacement stock that you say always has the side swivel and poor fitting front. My stock that the rifle came with fits well in the front and has the sling swivel on the bottom. That is why I originally thought it was a Chinese stock although not original. I am easily confused though, as I am old and blonde.

[echo1]

They ALL didn't get replacement wood. PAX

[running-man]

I am now a bit confused. You stated I had an Albanian replacement stock that you say always has the side swivel and poor fitting front. My stock that the rifle came with fits well in the front and has the sling swivel on the bottom. That is why I originally thought it was a Chinese stock although not original. I am easily confused though, as I am old and blonde.

Ahh I apologize I can see how what I wrote is confusing.

There are two 'Albanian' stocks:

#1 is the stock that was meant to go onto a Model 561 Albanian SKS.  This is a long stock than all other nations SKS stocks.  These stocks are the two outer stocks in this photo:



These stocks can be retrofitted to fit onto a standard SKS by cutting ~3" off the front and reforming the rabbet where the ferrule sits.  Everything else (crossbolt, trigger spring, pistol grip, front finger grips) are in the correct spot.  Even after doing this, there is typically an obvious disconnect up front where the stock is still way too thick and these are the ones I said you can see from a mile away.  These stocks all have side sling swivels.

#2 is the stock that Albanians produced as a replacement for broken, damaged, rotted and otherwise unusable standard stocks used in their stocks of Chinese type 56 SKS.  This replacement stock is shown as the center example in the photo above.  These stocks were precut with bottom sling swivels and are generally a drop in replacement.  I say generally because anyone who has had to fit a NOS Albanian replacement stock like this onto a Chinese type 56 action knows that they require a *ton* of fitment to even get close.  Oftentimes the resultant fit is poor and some of the Albanian imports have obvious signs of poor fitment still visible even after they were finalized by the armorer. 

Your stock is more indicative of a #2 Albanian replacement, though now that I look at the new photos, I suspect it may be a Chinese stock (as PAX hints above); either original to the rifle with the S/N obliterated, or off a donor Chinese gun or a NOS Chinese replacement. 

[Gashog]

Got it. I guess it's just hard to tell for sure. No matter really as it goes with the history of the rifles travels from China to Albania to my grimy little hands in Mossy Head, Florida. Really like this rifle!