SKS-FILES FORUM

Commercial Weapons => Rifles & Carbines => Lever Actions => Topic started by: Phosphorus32 on June 09, 2018, 10:12:28 PM

Title: Winchester Model 94
Post by: Phosphorus32 on June 09, 2018, 10:12:28 PM
My first lever action and my first Winchester, the Model 94, an American classic  :)

I've been casually looking for a couple of years but they've gone up beyond my tolerance. Finally snagged this one for a reasonable price at an auction a few weeks ago. It's chambered in the more scarce .32 Winchester Special that uses unique .321" diameter bullets, so ammo is a bit costly with few options (Hornady, Federal, Winchester) compared to the more common .30-30. The serial number indicates manufacture in 1949 according to the tables. Also the six-groove bore looks great.

Enjoy the pics. Also, please feel free to tell me all the stuff I undoubtedly don't know  rofl I'm a novice with these.

(https://preview.ibb.co/dDzJoT/right_01.jpg) (https://ibb.co/irmyoT)

(https://preview.ibb.co/m5NtNo/right_02.jpg) (https://ibb.co/bSff2o)

(https://preview.ibb.co/mJidoT/right_03.jpg) (https://ibb.co/ce0PTT)

(https://preview.ibb.co/mNejTT/right_04.jpg) (https://ibb.co/fKzUv8)


(https://preview.ibb.co/crZev8/left_01.jpg) (https://ibb.co/n18iNo)

(https://preview.ibb.co/igMg8T/left_02.jpg) (https://ibb.co/hv3uTT)

(https://preview.ibb.co/bWjev8/left_03.jpg) (https://ibb.co/n3Scho)

(https://preview.ibb.co/fqMyoT/left_04.jpg) (https://ibb.co/d2KUv8)

(https://preview.ibb.co/cTwba8/model.jpg) (https://ibb.co/goYdoT)

(https://preview.ibb.co/d9NhF8/SN.jpg) (https://ibb.co/mFTNF8)

(https://preview.ibb.co/ner9v8/proofs.jpg) (https://ibb.co/cki02o)

(https://preview.ibb.co/g5kr8T/hammer.jpg) (https://ibb.co/emrW8T)
Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: carls sks on June 10, 2018, 08:54:39 AM
nice find, looking good. thanks for sharing.  thumb1
Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: Greasemonkey on June 10, 2018, 09:31:44 AM
drool2  it's old and it's a lever. Now P32 will try to be Chuck Connors when no one is looking  thumb1

And....it's an interesting caliber... think1 one of the few calibers I really haven't seen, I've seen more in the .32-20WCF caliber than .32WS. I did ask a friend at a local shop, they usually carry 2 boxes of it, so someone around here uses it. chuckles1

Weird choice of size for a bullet... .321... a 7.9 Kurz is about the only one off the top of my head I know takes that size. I thought maybe it's a throwback from the black powder days, but a .32 cal muzzle loader typically uses a 310-.315 ball. Being it shares a case with the .30-30 Winchester, I wonder what they were hoping to accomplish.

And thats not typical P32 military stuff... thats a commercial made thang, send it to me so you don't get tainted or taint your military stuff with them commercial bugs.  :)
Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: Phosphorus32 on June 10, 2018, 03:45:10 PM
drool2  it's old and it's a lever. Now P32 will try to be Chuck Connors when no one is looking  thumb1

And....it's an interesting caliber... think1 one of the few calibers I really haven't seen, I've seen more in the .32-20WCF caliber than .32WS. I did ask a friend at a local shop, they usually carry 2 boxes of it, so someone around here uses it. chuckles1

Weird choice of size for a bullet... .321... a 7.9 Kurz is about the only one off the top of my head I know takes that size. I thought maybe it's a throwback from the black powder days, but a .32 cal muzzle loader typically uses a 310-.315 ball. Being it shares a case with the .30-30 Winchester, I wonder what they were hoping to accomplish.

And thats not typical P32 military stuff... thats a commercial made thang, send it to me so you don't get tainted or taint your military stuff with them commercial bugs.  :)

Thanks GM  rofl Yes a lever action is what I envision when I think of the old west but no Chuck Connors moves here.

It is an odd bullet diameter. I picked up two different boxes of 20 (Hornady and Remington) at the local Ranch & Home (Rednecks & Hombres) for about $1.35 per round. If it turns into a favorite shooter Iíll have to get a die set.

I may have to test it out and make sure it functions well before sending it to Appalachia, so donít forget to take a breath in the meantime  thumb1 :))
Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: Justin Hell on June 11, 2018, 09:56:32 PM
That thing is downright sexy in it's plain jane packaging....the stock totally looks ready for a mare's leg amputation...what's stopping you from being a rare bullet Rifleman? rofl2

Seriously...she is cute.  thumb1
Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: Greasemonkey on June 11, 2018, 10:23:07 PM
I think a Winchester Model 64 would look exceedingly sexy next to that Model 94, especially one in 32WS  thumb1
Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: Phosphorus32 on June 12, 2018, 12:33:15 AM
That thing is downright sexy in it's plain jane packaging....the stock totally looks ready for a mare's leg amputation...what's stopping you from being a rare bullet Rifleman? rofl2

Seriously...she is cute.  thumb1

Thanks, itís a keeper.

Interesting idea but I think Iíll skip the tax stamp  rofl
Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: Phosphorus32 on June 12, 2018, 12:36:37 AM
I think a Winchester Model 64 would look exceedingly sexy next to that Model 94, especially one in 32WS  thumb1

Enabler!  bat1  chuckles1
Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: Greasemonkey on June 12, 2018, 12:49:51 AM
I think a Winchester Model 64 would look exceedingly sexy next to that Model 94, especially one in 32WS  thumb1

Enabler!  bat1  chuckles1

Yeah...and?  senil1  rofl Just sayin it would look sexy...naw  nea1 it would be ubersexy, like Kate Upton sexy  thumb1
Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: xtriggerman on June 12, 2018, 11:30:11 AM
 Yup, a nice white tail death star ya got there..... Now that your pokin the lever monster with a stick, he's gona grab you by the a** and whisper "ninety two" in your ear.  :o
Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: Justin Hell on June 12, 2018, 11:44:38 AM
That thing is downright sexy in it's plain jane packaging....the stock totally looks ready for a mare's leg amputation...what's stopping you from being a rare bullet Rifleman? rofl2

Seriously...she is cute.  thumb1

Thanks, itís a keeper.

Interesting idea but I think Iíll skip the tax stamp  rofl

Are mare's legs short enough to require that?  There is no mention of that in the Henry catalog that is a staple for bathroom literature here.
I just think they are kind of rad for a cowboy gun....and I watched a few Rifleman episodes the other day, so my interest is a little piqued. My last lever action was a cork gun.  The last attempt at changing that ended up differently than expected...so the lever itch has yet to be scratched.  Someday soon. :)
Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: Greasemonkey on June 12, 2018, 12:00:48 PM
Yup, a nice white tail death star ya got there..... Now that your pokin the lever monster with a stick, he's gona grab you by the a** and whisper "ninety two" in your ear.  :o

Phos... he speaks the truth..  that same lever monster will say bad, horrible things like..  Thurdy-Thurdy, Marlin 1894, top, angle and side eject, Savage 99, 45-70 Gubment, and even moan OH!!! Henry in your ear.

He is a sneaky bastard.. he got me.  :o  chuckles1

That thing is downright sexy in it's plain jane packaging....the stock totally looks ready for a mare's leg amputation...what's stopping you from being a rare bullet Rifleman? rofl2

Seriously...she is cute.  thumb1

Thanks, itís a keeper.

Interesting idea but I think Iíll skip the tax stamp  rofl

Are mare's legs short enough to require that?  There is no mention of that in the Henry catalog that is a staple for bathroom literature here.
I just think they are kind of rad for a cowboy gun....and I watched a few Rifleman episodes the other day, so my interest is a little piqued. My last lever action was a cork gun.  The last attempt at changing that ended up differently than expected...so the lever itch has yet to be scratched.  Someday soon. :)

The way I understand Mares Leg lever actions... One can purchase a purpose manufactured Mare's leg from Henry, Chiappa, Rossi, and others.... pending local/state laws, technically, it is deemed a pistol/handgun and gets registered as such, it's looked at by the ATF like a pistol Ak/AR or even the Mossberg Shockwave shotgun.. But, to just up and chop down and make a Mare's leg out of a weapon that was originally a rifle, requires the tax stamp, because at that point it effectively becomes a SBR.
Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: martin08 on June 12, 2018, 01:26:34 PM

Enjoy the pics. Also, please feel free to tell me all the stuff I undoubtedly don't know  rofl I'm a novice with these.

Undoubtedly, you already knew that it was a flat band.  Right?
Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: Justin Hell on June 12, 2018, 01:52:26 PM
Yup, a nice white tail death star ya got there..... Now that your pokin the lever monster with a stick, he's gona grab you by the a** and whisper "ninety two" in your ear.  :o

Phos... he speaks the truth..  that same lever monster will say bad, horrible things like..  Thurdy-Thurdy, Marlin 1894, top, angle and side eject, Savage 99, 45-70 Gubment, and even moan OH!!! Henry in your ear.

He is a sneaky bastard.. he got me.  :o  chuckles1

That thing is downright sexy in it's plain jane packaging....the stock totally looks ready for a mare's leg amputation...what's stopping you from being a rare bullet Rifleman? rofl2

Seriously...she is cute.  thumb1

Thanks, itís a keeper.

Interesting idea but I think Iíll skip the tax stamp  rofl

Are mare's legs short enough to require that?  There is no mention of that in the Henry catalog that is a staple for bathroom literature here.
I just think they are kind of rad for a cowboy gun....and I watched a few Rifleman episodes the other day, so my interest is a little piqued. My last lever action was a cork gun.  The last attempt at changing that ended up differently than expected...so the lever itch has yet to be scratched.  Someday soon. :)

The way I understand Mares Leg lever actions... One can purchase a purpose manufactured Mare's leg from Henry, Chiappa, Rossi, and others.... pending local/state laws, technically, it is deemed a pistol/handgun and gets registered as such, it's looked at by the ATF like a pistol Ak/AR or even the Mossberg Shockwave shotgun.. But, to just up and chop down and make a Mare's leg out of a weapon that was originally a rifle, requires the tax stamp, because at that point it effectively becomes a SBR.

Makes perfect sense...forgive me.  Our gun laws in Montana could be legibly printed on the back of a postage stamp...sometimes I forget about the Federal stuff. :)
Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: martin08 on June 12, 2018, 02:19:06 PM
Oh, and if you use the correct polishing room data at the Winchester Collector Association (compiled by leading expert, Bert Hartman), you will find that your gun is a December 1948 build.  No flat bands were built in 1949.  If you remove your forestock, you will see the year '48' stamped on the bottom barrel flat.

But you knew that too, right?
Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: Greasemonkey on June 12, 2018, 02:34:20 PM
Oh, and if you use the correct polishing room data at the Winchester Collector Association (compiled by leading expert, Bert Hartman), you will find that your gun is a December 1948 build.  No flat bands were built in 1949.  If you remove your forestock, you will see the year '48' stamped on the bottom barrel flat.

But you knew that too, right?

Little off topic :) but was this the norm for Winchester, having barrel dates during this era or is it consistent across the board? my Winchester Model 74, which is a .22lr is from the same exact era, according to Winchester.. the serial dates it to 1950, but like you describe, the barrel date shows, what I am guessing would be Feb 1949.

(https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/s/n3pcqzkwo9le7aj/SAM_3330.JPG?dl=0)
Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: martin08 on June 12, 2018, 03:54:33 PM
For reasons unbeknown to anyone on the planet, Winchester factory dating on their website has always differed by a year or two from their own polishing room data, which Bert H. has access at the Cody Museum. 

If you order a Cody Museum letter for your  Winchester, it will have the correct finished product date.

The early 1949 date on your barrel is a pretty big clue that  your gun is likely a year older than Winchester website records.

I don't know what years the barrels were dated, other than I've seen them on early post-war.

Here is a link to the Winchester Arms Collector dating.

https://winchestercollector.org/dates/ (https://winchestercollector.org/dates/)

If your model 74 serial number is under 250,000, then it is 1949
Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: Loose}{Cannon on June 12, 2018, 04:21:59 PM
Noice get!

No twirling in the house.   bat1    You go outside and do that.    wink1
Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: Greasemonkey on June 12, 2018, 04:32:08 PM

https://winchestercollector.org/dates/ (https://winchestercollector.org/dates/)

If your model 74 serial number is under 250,000, then it is 1949
That site says 1950 as well, my serial is right there at that 250,000 point... its 252,5xxA
Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: Phosphorus32 on June 12, 2018, 07:29:01 PM
Yup, a nice white tail death star ya got there..... Now that your pokin the lever monster with a stick, he's gona grab you by the a** and whisper "ninety two" in your ear.  :o

rofl Thanks! Weíll see, this could be a new rabbit hole...and by ďrabbit holeĒ I mean opium den  chuckles1
Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: Phosphorus32 on June 12, 2018, 07:35:27 PM
Oh, and if you use the correct polishing room data at the Winchester Collector Association (compiled by leading expert, Bert Hartman), you will find that your gun is a December 1948 build.  No flat bands were built in 1949.  If you remove your forestock, you will see the year '48' stamped on the bottom barrel flat.

But you knew that too, right?

Nope and nope. Thanks for the info!  thumb1 Iíd heard the term ďflat bandĒ before but had never delved into it. Now, I see this is a relatively scarce feature (given the total number of 94s). Iím looking forward to getting home from work travel to disassemble this slim carbine. A letter sounds like a fun and interesting item to obtain, Iíll have to look into that. Iím thinking I probably did okay for $367.50  :)
Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: Phosphorus32 on June 12, 2018, 07:36:45 PM
Noice get!

No twirling in the house.   bat1    You go outside and do that.    wink1

Thanks LC! Iíll leave the twirling to the true cowboys (and majorettes)
Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: Loose}{Cannon on June 12, 2018, 08:39:53 PM
The John Wayne spin-cock is the preferred method of loading this rifle.  Give it a shot.
Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: eastbank on June 12, 2018, 08:59:50 PM
they do grow on you.
(https://preview.ibb.co/k0F2pd/DSCN1374_3.jpg) (https://ibb.co/cQ0DvJ)
Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: Phosphorus32 on June 12, 2018, 09:21:01 PM
they do grow on you.
(https://preview.ibb.co/k0F2pd/DSCN1374_3.jpg) (https://ibb.co/cQ0DvJ)

 :o Is that fourth one down with the gorgeous wood an octagonal barrel?
Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: martin08 on June 12, 2018, 11:59:17 PM
Iím thinking I probably did okay for $367.50  :)

You could near double your money on Gunbroker
Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: eastbank on June 13, 2018, 04:53:02 AM
yes, its a 1886 in 40-82, two years ago I shot a deer with it.
Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: xtriggerman on June 13, 2018, 01:15:49 PM
Yup, a nice white tail death star ya got there..... Now that your pokin the lever monster with a stick, he's gona grab you by the a** and whisper "ninety two" in your ear.  :o

rofl Thanks! Weíll see, this could be a new rabbit hole...and by ďrabbit holeĒ I mean opium den  chuckles1

    If you ever make it to rehab....... ***DONT*** let an old square bolt Marlin catch the corner of your half closed blood shot eye.
Very bad medicine.........
(https://i.imgur.com/lNJhhMx.jpg)
Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: Phosphorus32 on June 13, 2018, 09:35:16 PM
yes, its a 1886 in 40-82, two years ago I shot a deer with it.

First time Iíve heard of that particular cartridge. Interesting area but so far Iíve eluded the call of the old black powder cartridge firearms  rofl
Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: Phosphorus32 on June 14, 2018, 08:36:46 AM
Iím thinking I probably did okay for $367.50  :)

You could near double your money on Gunbroker

Thanks, not bad  :)

Sure enough, 48 is present on the barrel flat as promised.


(https://preview.ibb.co/dp2vvJ/408_BB519_67_E1_4_FAC_94_D6_AF4_F6688_F5_AD.jpg) (https://ibb.co/kGZm2y)
Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: martin08 on June 15, 2018, 10:33:41 AM
Great pic. 

The "struck through the blue" proof mark on the barrel along with the overall even wear appearance of the whole gun pretty much indicated an original barrel.  But the date seals the deal.

Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: Loose}{Cannon on June 15, 2018, 10:40:33 AM
Im guessing the stock was refinished?   
Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: Phosphorus32 on June 15, 2018, 06:26:02 PM
Im guessing the stock was refinished?

It is quite clean but doesn't appear to be refinished to my eye. Wood to metal fit is excellent; the metal isn't proud anywhere. If it was refinished, it had to be done carefully and a long, long time ago and accumulated some wear and a few mild bruises on the bottom.
Title: Re: Winchester Model 94
Post by: Loose}{Cannon on June 15, 2018, 08:46:49 PM
It just doesn't seem to match the wear of the metal.